Solar heaters flow rate and temperature rise

[JohnRoss]

I suspect that only the four of us, sorry kitty, five of us are looking at this thread now which is a shame as the point of my original post seems to have been lost in the knitting. The link to the drawings seems to show only a fan and heat exchanger and no sign of a heat pump i.e. compressor and refrigerant loop etc, maybe you sent the wrong link. Air source heat pumps are described in some detail here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_source_heat_pumps  It does not look as if anyone is going to come back with the figures I requested. I find it difficult to believe that that folk with solar heating in their pool don't know how it is performing but there you go!

So here goes with another tangent! Fish farmers use, or used to use when I had anything to do with it, an air blower to force air through an immersed pipe in their fish ponds which hold large number of fish like fresh water trout. The pipe was microporous and very small air bubbles would pass through the water increasing the oxygen levels. If hot air were used would the heat be extracted into the water before the bubble reached the surface? Each bubble would be its own heat exchanger in effect. I have no idea what the effect of the dissolved gases would be on the pool chemistry however. Only a very small proportion of the air gases would stay in a dissolved form in the pool..................any thoughts or is this getting silly?.......JR

PS The Desjoyaux system does have an air valve which if opened allows air bubbles to be injected into the main output flow from the pump, underwater massage?

[Théière]

If you want to keep fish in your pool, who are we to object [:D]

The lack of refrigerent just illustrates the lack of efficiency, the system is still an air source heat pump, just using pool water and the pool pump as the compressor so to speak. unless the roof in question is close by there will be losses through the pipe work. Buy one and let us know.

The addition of warm bubbles will cause the liberation of chlorine out of solution I suspect, but chemgeek will surely have a long and detailed explanation. The fish farmers are oxiginating the water not trying to poach their fish [:D]

[Poolguy]

Richard

I know that there has been a consultant looking into the sale of Chemigem into the US but the last I heard that the somewhat draconian health and safety laws, along with a protectionist import duty policy of the US has slowed progress so far. But the New system DM53 will go someway toward addressing some of the obstacles and I for one would have no problem selling even now to the US via mail order. If your Dollar ever recovers from the Subprime crisis then it might even be affordable.

As for Navitron V EPDM matting V (anything else), well I don't get too bogged down these days in the theoretical comparisons based on 'benchtest' results as they bear little resemblance to the actual performance in the field. My remarks covering 9m2 of evacuated tubes put 5°C addition to a 10 x 5m pool ( 1-2m deep) was an empirical observation on REAL EVENTS. There was 8 people there to witness this marvel, and yes the cover was OFF at the time (so what), in all my years of working on pools I have never seen such a result with EPDM mats, no matter what surface area is connected. I do not know how you can be so sure the "it wasn't due to the solar panel but mostly Sunlight hitting the pool"(ed Chemgeek) as you were not there at the time (or at least there was none answering to the name Richard or Chemgeek there), and to the best of my knowledge you do not have a Navitron system on your pool - to proffer your opinion what is and isn't the case concerning my product in my installation is a bit of a liberty - one which I have not afforded you. Even if you have calculated it (form what data and with what logic I am still not sure) then you are wrong, because it happened in Villemain (79) on Wed 10 Sept 08 just like its doing for a 100 or so other system across France at this time. Certainly, I am not stupid and I know what I saw and why it happened.

So now I'm going out to sell a 100 more or so, mainly to people who want to see it work, even if they do not fully understand how it works - because many of them also own a car without fully understanding that either. But they trust their eyes when they see the results and if its what they want - then they mostly buy it.

Good luck with your own pool then, but I would prefer if you resisted the temptation to further pick apart my products and posts as your analysis has long since outlived its welcome.

Andrew

 

[JohnRoss]

This is getting silly! Look guys too often some poor soul asks a seemingly simple question on this site only to have world war three break out and the original question lost in the debris. If this continues nobody is going to risk asking anything and a useful facility will be lost. Why not try to help the original poster and not attack him or her and each other......................................JR

PS I may take my ball and play somewhere else! [:P]

[Théière]

I know John Ross, I have had my post moderated, just for making an observation about the current tennants of America, It can't be racist, I never said anything about the red indians.

[JohnRoss]

I think one says Native Americans.  Ah the good old days of ABC Minors and Hopalong Cassidy!..........JG 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9BBa0yok68&feature=related

[Jonzjob]

We have had the occasional frog in our pool![8-)], Does that count???

[Clair]

[quote user="Jonzjob"]We have had the occasional frog in our pool![8-)], Does that count???[/quote]

[blink]

[Jonzjob]

Green tree frog Clair. What are you like??? They tend to sit in the overflow pipes in the skimmers and shout the length of the pool at each other... Very musical at night ?

Anyway Frog is not a derogatary term of the British against the French. It is a French one against the French! So there [:D]

If you ask me nicely I will tell you where it comes from!!![geek]

[Clair]

I was pulling your leg JJ! [:D]

We have a resident brown toad. Does that count?

[Jonzjob]

Clair, you are having me on! You pull my leg? I would never believe it [:-))][6]

Toads don't count because they don't live in the water! It's you frogs wot count peut etra ?[6]