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Mrs JJ visits local CPAM in Saintes as she is now working in order to change Carte Vitales etc. And guess what, no one has bothered to tell them about the recent changes ie the 14/12 and te more recent change about those on a E106, so it appears that the left hand does not know what the right hand is doing.
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The last letter from the French Health Minister does say that

"[she has] asked the director of the Sécurité Sociale to

disseminate by way of a circular, instructions for the implementation of the new legislation in order firstly, to maintain

the rights of access to CMU-b for EU nationals who were already affiliated on 23rd November 2007, date of entry into

force of the circular, and provide access to CMU-b to inactive EU nationals benefiting from an E106 at the same date..."

http://www.frenchhealthissues.eu/latest_news/minister_grants_relief_23_01.htm

Some offices seem to be more aware of the changes than others, but I expect all of them are still waiting for a formal notification through the CNAM.

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JJ

To be fair to the CPAMs, if you'd been following developments through this forum, it would appear that the CNAM appeared to have raised operational objections to the 14/12 circular, so the instructions regarding acceptance of the existing CMU affiliates whilst maintaining the exclusion of the E106 holders were not passed down to the individual CPAMs.  Their objections may well have had some influence on the more recent decision to maintain the rights of the E106 holders, thereby avoiding what the CNAM viewed as an administrative nightmare.

The latest decision will require an amendment to the procedures, so expect some delay in it being disseminated down to local level.

 

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SD - what does CNAM stand for as opposed to CPAM? (Caisse National?)

As far as we're concerned, they can take as long as they like to disseminate information, so that we won't find ourselves like many others I suspect, making contributions to CMU based on income earned before retirement (2006). We may all be hanging on to the private health insurance for the time being.

Thanks.

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SD - what does CNAM stand for as opposed to CPAM? (Caisse Nationale?)

As far as we're concerned they can take as long as they like to disseminate information so that many of us don't have to make our CMU contributions based on income earned before retirement (2006).

How many others will be hanging on to private insurance I wonder?

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Which is of course the ultimate irony in all this. All those who were contributing the most and more than paying their way, will take their business to the private sector, leaving the health system as a whole considerably worse off. It would also seem to open a legal door to well heeled French nationals to challange the right to opt out of the system and go for private health insurance care as well.
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Exactly Rupert.

This was a really well thought out plan?

Those who can contribute the most will withdraw and the French national debt will increase.

The problem is compounded by the local variation in interpretation / implementation  of rules e.g. our accountant still insists that we should pay for the social charge on (company) pension paid last year while were covered by E106s.

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By my  calculations one woud have to have an income in excess of 55000 euros in order for it to be more benificial to have totally private health care V CMU and top up.

I suspect ,going by the recent outcry,that not many people have that kind of income.

It has always been the case that income earned in the UK could be used to calculate ones first six months payments for CMU depending on when one arrives in France.

However with planning this need not be the case.

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[quote user="Boiling a frog"]

By my  calculations one woud have to have an income in excess of 55000 euros in order for it to be more benificial to have totally private health care V CMU and top up.

[/quote]

From that I would estimate a Private Insurance premium of around 4400€ per year !!!

I'm sure you could manage to pay a lot more and we could then start posting "I'd have to be earning 100 000 000€ to get PHI ...".

Maybe it depends on your age but I've been offered the same cover as provided by CPAM (i.e. doctors appointments, long term illnesses, etc. - but no pre-existing conditions) for a third of that but I am only in my 50's.  And that was a policy from a major French bank.

Ian

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This was posted by JALAN but unfortunatly they hit the report button and not the Post button so I am posting on their behalf (their bold not mine).

My wife and I live in the Aude and fortunately are both five year resident and in the CMU as at 30/11/07. Nevertheless we have been given a cut off date of 31/3/08. We believe it might be to accommodate holders of E1O6's that have expired or are about to. Can anyone out there in the Aude with an E106 confirm that they are covered beyond 31/3/08 please?

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My friend is in the same position. His intention is to wait a few weeks longer to give time for the Health Ministers letter to circulate and then take a copy of the said letter (from http://www.frenchhealthissues.eu ) to the CPAM office in Limoux and ask the 'helpful' chap there if he can explain why he has the letter throwing him out of he system. It's the same with everything like this in France, nobody takes ownership of things and it takes forever for government information to filter through and down the system. The trick is don't panic.
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Sadly, Quillan, it is a panicky situation. The problem seems to be that the UK end now believes that all is resolved and that it will "come out in the wash".  However, there is now the potential for many thousands more to end up in limbo land if the French authorities do not get their fingers out and at least implement the December statement, let alone the latest one.  There are now only seven or eight weeks for everybody who was in the CMU to get sorted (and for the CPAMs to complete all their documentation) even when the statement is finally acknowledged.  It seems to me that the result will be that instead of just having the estimated 3.5k applicants, whose E106s expired a month ago, to sort out - that unless the December statement is acted upon, the amount of panic will just increase.

We need to keep the pressure on the authorities both here and in the UK.  The Europe minister has been a primary mover in helping to get the changes at least agreed - we should now push him to get them implemented too.  He has posted on his blog again as if it's just a matter of a few unfortunate people waiting for the bureaucrats to wake up - we should make it clear that the problem could potentially get a lot more serious in a very few weeks, unless something happens soon.

http://blogs.fco.gov.uk/blogs/jim_murphy/archive/2008/02/01/16034.aspx

We are trying to get as much evidence on the situation for some new letters to the authorities.  Please e-mail us with the details of your problems - including (most importantly) the location of the CPAM you are dealing with, and their latest apparent position on this, be you an E106 expiree or an existing CMU subscriber.

[email protected]

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I don't think the majority situation is as complex as we might think....

The existing CMU accounts were reviewed as usual on 1 October 2007, and approved for a further year and are currently active.  Under the now obsolete rule change, their status would have been due for amendment on 31 March 2008, but now that this no longer applies, I expect they will merely have to do nothing, other than issue a brief letter confirming continuance of cover.

Let's try to keep the French focused on the E106....

 

 

 

 

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Our E106 forms expired last month and we received the letters from DWP last week.

Our little town (Pionsat in the arrondissement of Riom, Puy de Dôme) has a visit from CPAM every Wednesday from 10:30am until noon. Today, armed with everything, we went to see Pam, only to find a note on the door saying the reception is closed today! No explanation, but I wonder if it mey be a briefing.

I shall try again next week.
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[quote user="Sunday Driver"]

I don't think the majority situation is as complex as we might think....

The existing CMU accounts were reviewed as usual on 1 October 2007, and approved for a further year and are currently active.  Under the now obsolete rule change, their status would have been due for amendment on 31 March 2008, but now that this no longer applies, I expect they will merely have to do nothing, other than issue a brief letter confirming continuance of cover.

Let's try to keep the French focused on the E106....

 

 

 

 

[/quote]Although I agree with your sentiments, S/D, there are still hundreds of people who are existing CMU subscribers who are being told by certain CPAMs that they are to be chucked out on 31st March, as they do not even acknowledge the December statement, let alone the January one.  I hope you are correct, but I can still foresee problems, even for the apparently simple cases.  But for myself (who am one of those who has been told I would be thrown out at the end of March), I am certainly doing nothing for the moment.  I may not feel the same way if, in the middle of March, I'm still getting the same response though!
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Cooperlola

It might be helpful to run through the background to the situation you mention in order to give some reassurance to people who still have concerns.

As I understand it, the December statement was issued to the CNAMs and confirmed continuing eligibility for existing CMU subscribers, but not for E106 holders, other than through a number of complex exceptions.  The CNAMs objected to the administrative complexity of this, so it would be safe to assume that they did not pass anything down to the CPAMs whilst the issue was still under discussion. On this basis, the CPAMs will have received no official instructions regarding that change in eligibilty of CMU subscribers.  That's why officially there's 'no change'.

Whilst the CNAMs objections to the December statement may have resulted in denying the CMU people the immediate comfort of having their CPAM saying 'don't worry, everything's changed and you'll be OK in March', it's likely that the CNAMs' refusal to implement the proposed change may have had a positive influence on the health minister's subsequent decision to scrap the dual qualification and admit the E106 holders as well.  So, a small temporary sacrifice on the part of the CMUer's 'peace of mind' for the benefit of the E106ers...

Until the updated January change permeates down, people will still get the same negative CPAM response based on the original position. 

As far as problems, even for the apparently simple cases, everyone is the same - they are in the CMU, full stop.  No individual file evaluations or review will be necessary.  The usual procedure for an administrative exercise like this would be for the CPAMs to set up an batch update file to run overnight on 31 March to deactivate all the relevent CMU accounts.   Even if the instructions arrive that day, they just have to keep their finger off the 'start' button.  If the instruction arrives late, then they run another overnight update to reverse the situation.

Sorry for continuing to labour this point, but I write this because I really do feel for people who are banging their heads against the wall and getting upset at a response which will not ultimately apply to them....

 

   

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Like many others the last communicaion (Jan 08) from CPAM  was that our cover would end 31/3/08 even though we know we qualify through being in the CMU as at 30/11/07, having been resident in excess of five years and through acute illness.

We would like to know if possible of any persons qualified to enjoy cover in the CMU  --  AUDE have had notification of continued cover beyond 31/3/08.

Thankyou

 

Jalan

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