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Can you explain exactly what you after by these posts? 

You are appear to be offering nothing to those who will be disenfranchised from the CMU on expiry of their E 106s or are below retirement age or providing the name of a healthcare insurer

Your site appears to be only about wanting to charge more than 21€ for a consultation for English speakers, who will have to pay this fee in full in future if kicked out of the CMU.

Incidentally my French Doctor does not ever, no matter how long I spend with him, charge more than the going rate and I doubt any others on here can say differently.  Are you proposing to offer a discount for a five minute consultation then?  There are many English speaking French doctors all over on the south west if you want them, some do, some don't.

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[quote user="LisaJ"]

Is anyone able to clarify re existing conditions? If, for example, someone has a long-term condition of contolled hypertension, does this mean that they would not be covered by an insurer for a future heart attack or stroke? Or does it simply mean that they would not be covered for hypertension drugs / blood tests / cardiograms etc? It is hard to understand the advantages / disadvantages of the different offerings without some understanding of what it might mean in practice. Is there anyone out there with a good understanding of health insurance who might be able to help?

regards

Lisa

[/quote]Might I suggest that you speak to one of the agents in the list at the top of this thread.  The advantage of using such an agent is that they do have the good understanding which you seek.  All I mention are English-speaking and two are forum members.  I can make a personal recommendation if you pm me.  By contacting them  and explaining your problems, you are under no obligation to pay any of them until you take out a policy.
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[quote user="Ron Avery"]

Can you explain exactly what you after by these posts? 

You are appear to be offering nothing to those who will be disenfranchised from the CMU on expiry of their E 106s or are below retirement age or providing the name of a healthcare insurer

Your site appears to be only about wanting to charge more than 21€ for a consultation for English speakers, who will have to pay this fee in full in future if kicked out of the CMU.

Incidentally my French Doctor does not ever, no matter how long I spend with him, charge more than the going rate and I doubt any others on here can say differently.  Are you proposing to offer a discount for a five minute consultation then?  There are many English speaking French doctors all over on the south west if you want them, some do, some don't.

[/quote]Ron, to be fair - although I'm 100% with you on this - the problem may have arisen because the title of my original post is misleading.  I have now changed it to emphasise the insurance aspect.

Dr Casson, hopefully you are aware that at present, most posters' concerns are about being able to pay for health cover at all - I doubt whether the language in which they are treated is the most important thing to them at the moment.

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Hi everyone,

We have just changed our status back from 'Illegal Immigrants' to the European Citizen in France as we were yesterday.  During the weekend, we waded through all the 'print offs' of cover and quotes for Health Insurance.  Tough job when we were previously expecting to buy into the French system @ 8%, we are fit and well so it was easy for us, we thought. 

This afternoon, we went to our AGF Insurance man armed with plenty of 'competition' to negotiate.  After hearing our tale of woe, he was amazed at the situation we are all in.  He was polite, though he smiled he didn't rub his hands once!  We have had everything (House, car and health) including complimentary insurance with him for 2.5 years.  So we knew he could offer something, but not what.

After explaining that AGF wasn't yet in a position to help us as they had been caught 'on the hop', he began to show us other policies that he has trauled the market for, some the same as we had seen and others we hadn't seen.  There were 555 euros/month and 800+/month, and in between.  So after explaining, that we were just early retired teacher and engineer, not oil drillers he then discussed our other options.  Basically, we had to reduce cover; the long and the short of it is we now have cover very simiar the cover that buying into the French NHS would have given us.  For a similar price and hopfully we won't need to use it.  For us, 270 Euros/month (270-120 paid previously = 150/month more for the 19 months before E121). We are covered from today as we had already got complimentary insurance and the deposit was vastly reduced. We had to fill in a full page of declaration questions but we had nothing to hide, and he had our complimentary recors, nothing paid out in 2.5 years. My advice to you people that need to get covered now or soon, see your current Insurance person armed with the best quotes you can find, they will do their best to keep your business. We are now expecting UK to issue E106s to cover every, as life is like that!

This post is offered to give some of you normal people like us some help or direction.  Hopefully the situation wll change for the better for the people with pre-conditions, good luck.

For any people local to Perigueux feel free to PM for further direction, if required.

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Just stumbled onto this website this afternoon, whilst looking for info.and guidance. We're early retirees too, from the Channel Isles which brings it's own set of problems. Jersey, not being an E.U country,doesn't have either a reciprocal health or tax agreement agreement with France. We took professional financial advice before arriving here 6 years ago, in order to establish what our tax and health outgoings  would be likely to be, given that joining the French health system was obligatory. We hooked into the system and started paying in, during the first three months we were here. [Unlike the UK, Jersey has no 'E' forms entitling us to free anything!] We have lived, to date, on my Police pension, quite adequately. Two years into our residency here, we adopted a Russian child through the French system. He suffers with hemiparesis,  and is mildly handicapped, with a weakness in the right hand and lower leg. Enquiries with the health authorities and our GAN mutuelle insurances before the adoption, to establish if our 'cotisations' would remain the same, or rise, to accommodate any treatment he might receive were favourable, and luckily they remained as they were. That's a bit about our background.

 Given the present changes, for which we can get no concrete assurances from anybody, my husband phoned the English speaking CPAM helpline that was being advertised, this morning, and the only advice we were given was that they might know more at the end of October. I am still waiting for a return call from the CMU in Cahors in the Lot, who I phoned also this morning. Our options, unless the situation changes, are either my husband finding work in order to remain affiliated to the CMU, which would continue to offer protection for our son, or to go down the road of private medical cover, which would not only be a great deal more expensive, but which would not include our son, due to his existing condition, according to one private health firm I telephoned to for a quote.. Payments for treatment, such as the 'Botox' injections in the lower leg, and the 'caliper shoes' would have to be borne by ourselves. Under these circumstances, we could probably not afford to continue living in France, and as house prices have risen phenomenally back 'home', we couldn't afford to return there either. Like a great many people, this situation, which is not of our making, has caused a lot of anguish, and we're not sure what to do next. My husband has signed on for work with the 2 agencies in our area, but like many small towns, employment is limited, and, I regret to say, seems to be  biased in favour of the French! Earlier this year he sent his C.V. to approx. 15 local businesses, of which I believe only 3 bothered to reply in the negative. So the employment option isn't looking too good at present. We've been reading about this '5 year residency business'; can anyone explain what that's all about?

Apologies for rambling on, but it is very worrying. We're wholeheartedly behind you all with our support!

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As you have been here for 6 years, by the sound of the news as we know it today, then you should qualify for a titre de sejour which should give you continued CMU rights.  However, as most of our information is based upon EU legislation then the residency right may be an even greyer area for you than us.

The only way, however, which we can establish that this is the case, is for somebody on here to try it.  Please speak to your Mairie, Prefecture and your CPAM because individual cases will give us the hard information everybody needs.  All else is speculation based on the best information we have from one moment to another.

However, the goalposts shift every day so keep watching (the locked and stickied "Story so Far" thread is the one with the firm info' in it.)  But one day we think we've got it right, the next day, no...[:-))]

I don't know if it helps but, you are not alone!  Everybody is doing all they can to at least clear this up once and for all, and at best to get something done about it.

There is a separate board on here for non-EU citizens over here.  You may find that a post on there would yield some info.  There may be people on here from outside the EU who know the drill, as it were. 

Bon courage, and good for you for adopting as you did.  I for one don't think you should be penalised for being good people.

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Ooh, even more complicated*.

Since you are not citizens of the EU (UE) then most of the stuff we have all been looking at (including Coop's reference to 5 year residency) probably won't apply.

Have you tried approaching Brussels to find out whether you should, in general, be treated in Europe as equivalent to an EU citizen or as an alien? [I thought there were special rules for residents of CI, IOM, Andorra, Gibraltar etc.]

*Not least because even the Europa site seems to be in a state of flux, e.g.:

http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/fr/citizens/index.html

which includes (today):

Vos droits en matière de résidence et de

mobilité dans l'Union européenne ont fait l'objet d'améliorations

récentes. Vous trouverez bientôt sur «L'Europe est à vous» des

informations actualisées sur les droits de résidence et les procédures

d'entrée. Entretemps, vous pouvez consulter des informations d'ordre

général sur ces thèmes en cliquant ici.

which leads through to here:

http://ec.europa.eu/justice_home/fsj/citizenship/movement/fsj_citizenship_movement_fr.htm

with much talk about EU citizenship.

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Thanks for the info. As my husband is from the UK, I am [or was] under the impression I was, as wife, 'covered' by his E.U. status. I don't quite know what to think now! Frankly the authorities in Jersey aren't any help at all in this area. I'll do as suggested and look at the non E.U. pages on here, then if necessary, take it further with the mairie and prefecture. This could be very important to clarify now, seeing as it is my police pension we live on. 
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Mrs P I  would think that you are quite right. As  your husband is from an EU country his family is also entitled to be here under the same conditions. If permanent residence (legal residence for 5 years)  is accepted as giving the right to continued affiliation to the CMU then that should apply to the whole family. 

The trouble is although the legal  texts  clearly say that permanent residents no longer have to prove resources (and in consequence should be able to join/continue in  the CMU) no French official has  yet confirmed this. The British Embassy says that this is the case and the two internet newsletters that came out yesterday also at suggest that French sources will concede this. 

http://www.connexionfrance.com/expatriate-news-article.php?art=45

http://www.french-property.com/newsletter/2007/10/1/health/

http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1059132495834

Unfortunately many of us had our hopes raised a couple of weeks ago by the British embassy  (who said no-one in the system would be affected) only for the French to say the very next day that we would have 6 months to find private health  health care. At the moment we don't know who to believe. Its a very worrying time for everyone.

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This recent post in another thread is interesting

"My parent's CV ran out on 30/9 so with fear and trepidation I phoned the CPAM yesterday to ask where the attestation was.  They phoned back today and asked, is your father retired ?? Oh yes   And is he retired in his own country ? errr No he's not 65 yet
In that case, under the new rules we will not be renewing your father's cover.
However during the telephone conversation it appears :-
They know of the 6 month rule but haven't had it communicated to them from the head office of CPAM and so cannot act on it. 
They also know of something changing with the 5 year rule but also cannot act on it.
If you sign on you will not be covered by CMU
If you start work VIA  cheques d'emploi once you have worked your 60 hours you will be covered
If You go back to uk and work, get a new e106 and return you'd be covered as long as you are in receipt of an E106 or E121.

They will not write confirmation that they are not renewing at this time as they have not been told to get the CV's returned and she said at the moment the CV's are not blocked but she told me to get looking for private health care and as soon as the 6 month rule is communicated to them she'd get in touch.  I think i'll phone next week and hope that the wheels are in motion for the 6 month rule being applied to the local CPAMS by then."

What seems to have happened here is that the CPAM knew there are changes afoot and are sitting on things until they get clear guidelines.  I imagine that this will be common practice in the early weeks - letting entitlements run until they have an official communication from above.  As "above" doesn't know what it's doing, then there's little hope for those at local level.

You could certainly get your o/h to check your EU membership status as his wife.  At least then you'd have ammunition.  One thing is that I suspect that at least he and your child would be considered to be EU citizens - I can't see that being contested.

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Yes, it's certainly a very worrying time, as the messages we are getting are mixed or confusing. To say the left hand doesn't know what the right is doing is very obvious in this matter. I telephoned our CMU in Cahors this morning, as nobody had bothered to return my call yesterday. It seems they are in a state of total chaos, and just about as much in the dark as anybody else. They really don't seem to know what the final outcome is likely to be, as it's early days yet, and all the individual dossiers relating to persons likely to be affected  have to be studied carefully, I was told. I was also told what I already know, in that someone has to work a minimum of 60 hours per month to be [or remain inscribed]. They wouldn't be drawn on this 5 year residency business, said it wasn't their place to comment or make decisions in those matters. Bit cagey. Anyway, they are not withdrawing the Cartes Vatale for the moment, so we [here in the Lot], shouldn't be worried about getting a letter asking to hand them in immediately. That's what the lady I spoke to said. It wouldn't surprise me if what happens in reality may turn out to be totally different!! As I stated in a previous post, my husband has signed on for work, temporary or otherwise at 2 agencies in our area. He starts on a part time basis at Andros tomorrow, but we don't know for how long.[ The last stint he did earlier this spring certainly didn't amount to 60 hours and then the agency seemed to forget about him, and didn't contact him until this morning. Must have been something to do with his going in yesterday  to remind them he was still available!]  I was told that I could always go and see the Social security rep. at St Cere, at Ecole Burseille [or something like that!], Place Gambetta, open Wednesday afternoons  between 2 and 5.30, but at the moment, I don't think I am likely to get any different info. from them. All in all, it's a rather frustrating waiting game.
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  • 2 weeks later...

A "chi  nk" of light is appearing re insurance and chronic conditions.  Here is a copy of an e-mail received from Kurt Harper today:

"Good afternoon,
things are moving very well, I have an big name Insurer looking at it
presently and they are looking having cover for pre-existing with just a
simple application form. This I believe will fit out criteria perfectly, if
they come through on their promise.

I have also made contact with an overseas insurer, which can cover
pre-existing conditions on a case by case basis at a premium of course and
meeting up with them soon to look over their offering.

So things are progressing forward."

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  • 1 month later...

I am like many others I'm sure needing to get some private health quotes sorted before January.  I keep burying my head in the sand then having a go at dealing with it.  Yesterday after trawling the high street none of the companies I spoke to could offer me full insurance - Groupama, AGF, AXA. GMF and my own current Mutuelle Eovi.  My heart sinks when I see the premiums required from some of the online sites that I have visited and I wondered if anyone has been successful in finding cover under around 3,500 euros for 55-60 age bracket.  I will of course continue to search and let you know if I have any success. Many thanks, Hester.

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Hi - We use this company for Top-up insurance at the moment and I'm very happy with them. They have just introduced a new policy called the 'Platine' which might fit the bill for those that are likely to be chucked out of CMU. They are advertising a price of 1618 euros per person for the age bracket you mentioned. If we end up getting the elbow I'll probably end up with them. They also have an advert about this on page 14 of The Connexion and page 6 of French News (both latest issues).

http://www.exclusivehealthcare.com/index.php

Cheers, Paul
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To be precise, Paul, it's 1377 for 50-54 and certainly 1618 for 55-59 and 2143 for 60-65, so the poster above you wasn't far off - it's still a lot of money for anybody 60 - 65 which is probably the majorityof those who are affected! Although to be fair I've thus far found them a good company to deal with.

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Just for information, my health insurer (top up policy with AGF) is now steadfastly refusing to respond to my emails regarding my right (not sure whether I have one, but that doesn't stop me trying !) to cancel my existing policy outside of the current time limits (my E106 expires January 08).   They assure me that they can provide me with a 'suitable alternative product' but seem somewhat reluctant to

a.  provide details or costs of such product

or

b.  answer my queries as to what happens if said product does not meet my requirements.

Sigh ... a stroppy phone call is in order it seems.

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Thanks, I have checked it out and hopefully this might suit us.  It's just a case of when to commit isn't it?  I am going to read through the small print that I have downloaded to check what notice we need to give on our Mutuelle.  I keep hanging on just in case.  Many thanks to all of you who are putting in so much hard work on behalf of us all.  Hester.
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I notice on the AngloInfo Brittany (yes, I know) site that a company called BML Assurance at Dinan is advertising, with reference to full private health assurance.

To quote one paragraph of its advert:

"For UK citizens who have legally lived in France for five years, you need to obtain a permanent resident certificate from your Prefectures Office, you can then not be refused access into the CMU."

 

The company can be contacted at: [email protected] - there seems to be a web address www.angloagence.com

 

Usual disclaimers apply - no experience of the agency or connection with the people - we don't even need French health assurance.

 

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Just a quick update on my posting earlier regarding my health insurance agent and their lack of response regarding my desire to cancel my current top up outside of the renewal period.

I have now had a further communication from my insurance agent (my policy is with AGF) and they have now agreed that due to my change in circumstances the 2 month renewal period will be waivered, and no charges incurred.    They also promise details of a new policy which will be suitable, soon.   How soon ... we shall see, similarly how suitable I suppose.

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I would strongly recommend that anybody who is negotiating with private providers, holds off for a week or so.  We have had this from the Social Security Department today:

Les choses ont bien avancé et nous sommes maintenant dans la dernière ligne droite. Nous espérons pouvoir publier le texte rapidement. N'hésitez pas à consulter régulièrement notre site www.securite-sociale.fr

 

Cordialement

Stéphanie Gaillard

 

Things are well advanced and we are now on the home straight. We hope to be able to publish the text shortly. 


This was unsolicited so there is a good chance that rapidly means what it says.  If you turn out to be one of the people who gets some relief from the new rulings (whatever they are) it would be a great shame if you had committed yourself to an unneccessary expense.  They want your money - they will wait seven days!

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Indeed, as long as you ensure that you get agreement to waiver your current notice period, there is absolutely no reason to even think about a new policy until middle of December (sorry, that is for those whose E106 is expiring start January).   They will be lining up to take your money.

 

 

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exclusivehealthcare

Could I ask if anyone has had problems getting through to the above company recently?  Their website has "crashed" at the application form stage for top up and I have been put straight onto answerphone when I have telephoned on several occasions over the past few days.

I am assuming that they are very busy at the moment, but as I saw their company as maybe being an affordable option for January I'm a bit disconcerted that I can't make contact.  Also for anyone who uses them do you know if they accept credit card payments over the phone as I've been stung in the past on the internet.  Many thanks, Hester. 

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Hester

I am with this company at present though I am changing in January.  I think there is only ever the one person, Polly, at the other end of the phone.  She is very helpful, however, and will ring back if you leave your number.  And yes, I believe they will take a credit card over the phone though I sent my details in the post as I had other information for them at the same time.

They've been pretty good and I'm only changing because our insurance agent has found us the same cover for a considerable saving.

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