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Hi

I have an ongoing problem with shutting down my PC. It freezes and I can only shut it down by pressing the on/off switch.

When I start it again, it goes through an "illegal shutdown detected" routine and works fine, but the same problem reappears at shutdown time...

I am now going through a step-by-step startup routine and I have noticed a couple of Symantec leftovers trying to load at startup, even though I am not using any Symantec product anymore:

C:\program~1\symantec.386 and symtdi.vxd

When asked to load these I type NO and it seems to solve the shutdown problem over the last 2 days. Also, the "whirring" noise that I was getting every 2 seconds through the day on the hard drive has now stopped.

As I see it, there is a conflict somewhere and I would like to know if I can safely remove these commands from the registry, and if so, how?

I have used regcleaner but it has not made any permanent difference to the shutdown problem.

This seems to have started after I uploaded the recent ZoneAlarm version 6.0.667.000

any help gratefully welcome

Clair

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Personally I have never been too impressed with Symantec products and when I have used then have also had problems getting them to uninstall completely, though I’ve not experienced the same shut-down problems as you have. To qualify my “opinion” re: Symantec, it is my opinion and I’m aware that many others do use their products (I think there are far better and cheaper/free products for virus and firewall).

Anyway. Editing the registry may be dangerous, particularly where these thing might be added all over the place. Maybe an easier way to stop them starting is to use a decent anti-spyware system that allows you to block/disable startup programs. I know that both Winpatrol and Microsoft anti-spyware both do this through an easy to use GUI (probably others as well). In the Micsrosft anti-spyware its in the “System Expolrers” bit (pretty obvious when you get there). Both are free downloads (and seem to work). In both they can display a list of startup programs and you and they select and eg. Press a “block” or “disable” button to stop the selected thing/component starting. This is free and might be safer than editing the registry.

I used these to disable a lot of the Real Player automatic start-ups that seem associated. Also, a lot of packages these days also seem to add an “Update checker” that is always left running occasionally checking for updates. I personally don’t like these so use the anti-spyware to disable them.

Ian

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Thank you Ian

I have Windows ME, so I don't think I can use MS Antispyware with it (Am I right in thinking this works with XP?)

I have Spybot and Ccleaner so I will look at their Startup options. I will also download Winpatrol, just in case it helps!

I too have had numerous problems with Symantec and got a refund on my last purchase, but the darned software is very invasive...

Any other suggestions?

Clair
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>>I have an ongoing problem with shutting down my PC. It freezes and I can only shut it down by pressing the on/off switch......This seems to have started after I uploaded the recent ZoneAlarm version 6.0.667.000<<

Hi Clair

I have exactly the same problem. I was blaming either MS for a security download or the latest upgrade of ZoneAlarm but I too used to have Norton (2003) before uninstalling it. Whilst rooting around in my hard-drive I found all kinds of Norton files still there and I wondered if they might be conflicting with something. How do you slow down your start-up procedure so that you can see what is asking to be loaded? I don't mind deleting some old Norton files - providing they are not shared - to see if it makes any difference. I have Win 98 and it was fine until this happened.

Thanks

Sue

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Norton Anti-virus a couple of years ago used to stop some Windoze 95, 98, etc. (DOS rather than NT based) systems from shutting down. It relates to their trying to check floppies on system shutdown. There used to be a setting you need to uncheck, a change to the registry and a change to config.sys to solve it. The “fix” used to work in about 50% of cases and detailed instructions were in symantecs Knowledge Base. I would have hoped that would have been fixed by now as this was ages ago. Also, it was with NAV running and not with it uninstalled !! I doubt it’s the same problem and I would think it best to just get rid of the Symantec stuff (better free ones available).

Ian

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[quote]Thank you IanI have Windows ME, so I don't think I can use MS Antispyware with it (Am I right in thinking this works with XP?)I have Spybot and Ccleaner so I will look at their Startup options. I will...[/quote]

IMHO I would :

Ditch ME and definitely ditch Norton (Symantec).

Both truly awful !!

For an easy life install XP with SP2, Adaware, Spybot and AVG antivirus (the last 3 can all be downloaded for free).

Do your PC housekeeping (spyware and virus checks, updates, cache clean and defrag.) weekly.

I wouldn't touch Norton or McAfee with a bargepole!

Or AOL for that matter ; all far too intrusive.

Alfa.

 

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My system which is XP Pro with SP2 went crazy after installing Zone alarm pro trial and also zone log. I now just have zone alarm free firewall with avast anti virus, but had to do a system restore to initialise the adsl modem which went on the blink, I think the problem was with zone log changing other settings.
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[quote]>>I have an ongoing problem with shutting down my PC. It freezes and I can only shut it down by pressing the on/off switch......This seems to have started after I uploaded the recent ZoneAlarm v...[/quote]

Sue, this is based on Windows ME and I don't know if other Windows versions will do the same:

to to a step-by-step start-up, keep your control key pressed as you turn your PC on; in a few seconds, you'll have a DOS screen with several start-up options.

You have 30 seconds to choose which option you want before the PC defaults to normal start-up.

RE Symantec/Norton and Restore: I uninstalled it about 8 months ago, so cannot restore back to that, but thanks for the tip!

RE cleaning-up: I have used Spybot to clean up the PC in depth and found a way to disable the offending Symantec files without removing them. The PC seems to work fine now. Hurray!!!

Re cleaning and maintenance: I had Spybot, Ccleaner, Regcleaner, AdAware and now Winpatrol!!! I think I'm covered!!!

Thanks to you all!

Clair

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Clair, I am sorry to say that Windows ME is notorious for causing problems and you are not the first to have suffered this kind of problem and much worse. Windows 98 Second Edition, which preceded it was much better. Even worse is a system that has been upgraded to ME from a previous version. Don't even think about trying a further upgrade from ME or you may well end up in an even bigger mess.

Assuming you have all your original operating system, driver and software disks, the best thing you can do is back-up all your files you want to keep and then get help to make a dos boot disk, reformat your hard drive and start all over again. When it comes to reloading Windows try and use any version other than ME.

Sorry that this isn't good news but it is likely to be your best option to get things running smoothly again other than just buying a new computer.

Regarding the comments made by others about Norton, McAfee etc. I am sorry to say that there will always be some people who are convinced they can get something for nothing so why should they pay for it. Sadly in the real world this isn't the case. The likes of Norton and McAfee security software offers excellent protection to computer users when properly installed, used correctly and, most importantly, providing the annual subscriptions are up to date. The resources these companies have are huge and can be perpetuated through the income from software licenses. Choose not to believe me if you wish but don't blame anyone else if one day you find you have been caught out. There's no such thing as a free lunch !

On the subject of removing software, this is not something to do lightly. Some software can be extremely well bedded into your operating system. Small programs are generally not too much of a problem if you use the ad/remove programs facility in your Control Panel. For larger programs look for an uninstall option in the program folder or even on the original cd. If in doubt, don't attempt removal without taking expert advice. As someone has already mentioned, removing AOL software can be a disaster as you are likely to find that Internet Explorer has also been removed, possibly leaving you without a web browser at all !
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[quote]Clair, I am sorry to say that Windows ME is notorious for causing problems and you are not the first to have suffered this kind of problem and much worse. Windows 98 Second Edition, which preceded it ...[/quote]

Hi Eslier

Thanks for your comments.

I have used Norton/Symantec products on the same computer very successfully. The problems I mentioned having with them only occured when I upgraded from 2003 to 2005 AV earlier this year. I have since uninstalled as recommended by them and got my money back. The existing Symantec left-overs have been disabled (as far as I can say but I'm no expert!). Based on my unhappy experience with Symantec/Norton, I will not use them again (I did pay a subscription and kept the software updated automatically).

I am quite happy wih ME and I do not believe changing to XP will make me happier! I will have to use XP if/when I upgrade the PC and that is likely to be forced on me rather than by choice.

Since ditching Symantec/Norton and installing AVG Free + ZoneAlarm to do the same work earlier this year, I have had 4 virus alerts, all caught by AVG with no action on my part and no damage to the PC. I also have A LOT more free memory available.

I use other clean-up tools to keep the PC sweet and they have helped me in this particular instance, as the problem which had brought me here has now been resolved.

I think your course of action is very drastic and even if I had not resolved the problem, I would have been really worried about attempting anything you suggested.

I use my PC as I do my car: I drive it, but do not need know what makes it tick below the bonnet! Come to think of it, I'd rather look under my car bonnet than into my PC!!

Clair

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With a lot of these types of proposed solutions people can forget what they actually use their computer for (e.g. web browsing, e-mail, word processing, spreadsheets, etc.). It is these applications that provide the functionality we want, the operating system active as an aid to those applications.

Having worked in IT for many years I am very much of the “if it aint broke don’t fix it”. Microsoft would love us to all feel the need to spend loads of money upgrading the entire time and the newer Operating Systems may well be “better”. However, they run the same applications as we were using before so we end up spending time and money and have the same functionality.

Norton is very memory hungry and McAfee has a big impact on system performance (speed). The ZoneAlarm and AVG is an excellent combination and I believe more secure and far more efficient on system resources There is loads of “free” software available that is excellent and definitely worth using (e.g. Firefox, AVG, etc.). How much you pay for something does not necessarily dictate how good it is. Just because you can buy something in PC World does not mean it is “the best”, etc.

Ian

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I have used all the free programmes mentioned earlier, AVG, Spybot and AdAware with great results. I have also down loaded a program called Shields Up which goes through you system checking for loopholes.These coupled with XP SP2 and its firewall, with Wanadoo anti spam I have been having a very quiet life thank Heavens.I used to get a lot of problems before i ran these.
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