pugwash Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Yes Mel but you haven't answered the question, why has anybody travelling at what is considered to be a dangerous speed, in the middle lane, got any right to feel affronted because the whole world will not get out of their way ? And if you are in the inside lane and want to get out to overtake a slower vehicle it's the same arrogant speeders that will not move over to let you out. So, if there is a frequent slower vehicle in the inside lane, you can travel at a more consistent speed in the middle lane. It's amazing the amount of people that still think it's ok to do 90 in the middle lane because nobody will see them there !. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jc Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 The Gendarmes will have a speed camera on a bridge over the autoroute before the tolls and radio to a car after the tolls to stop you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 23, 2007 Author Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="pugwash"]Yes Mel but you haven't answered the question, why has anybody travelling at what is considered to be a dangerous speed, in the middle lane, got any right to feel affronted because the whole world will not get out of their way ? [/quote]pugwash - sorry, I have no idea... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Rule 238 of the UK highway code is the pertinent one for the other side of the channelhttp://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/23.htm#227"return to the left hand lane... if you are delaying traffic behind you"But yes, it also of course says you must not drive over 70 mph! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyh4 Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="Ron Avery"] "As I understood it, when you are on the Motorway you are timed from the 'Billet' you collect and then hand it in at the Toll Booth" I have never in 20 years of autoroute motoring in France seen anybody asked to produce their billet, have you???This is an absolute urban myth, put out on GM TV one morning , it just does not happen. Think about it, you could be doing 150kph all the way, stop in a Aire and record the same journey time as a car doing 110kph. If there are Gendarmes at the toll booths they are checking approach speeds as they go down sharply on the approaches. [/quote] I don't think it's a total urban myth Ron, since the state owned (then) motorway companies were prosecuted under the data protection act for "allowing" the gendarmes to look in through the booth windows and see the average speed displayed on the screen. (About 5 or 6 years ago IIRC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Anglia Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="pugwash"]OK, while we are this kind of mood, tell me what you think of this conundrum. There is always a lot of moaning about "middle lane hogs" in the UK, so tell me you wise birds, if someone is doing 75 mph (therefore illegally) in the middle lane, and someone else comes storming up at a faster speed, has he or she got any right to be annoyed by the "middle lane hog " just because his illegal speed is greater. ???[/quote][Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Pugwash, imho, those who want to roar along should just use the fast lane and put up with the consequences. They don't seriously believe that you can only get done if you're in the outside lane do they? Just so long as they get out of the way when somebody even faster comes along! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 It's the only reason I can think of for the way they behave, I have seen it so often, and you have as well probably, they come screaming along ducking in and out of the middle lane, coming right up behind you and cutting back in often less than a cars length in front, and they do this until they out of sight in the distance. In the mean time the outside lane is relatively empty. Don't tell me they are pulling over because the Highway code says so, if the Highway code meant so much to these guys they wouldn't be doing 85 / 90 + in the first place. Also, when Mel says middle lane hogs cause tailbacks, what he means is that middle lane hogs cause some people to drive at closer to the speed limit than they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daktari Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Pugwash - going back to your query re those travelling illegally at 75mph (I presume you are referring to UK rather than French motorway limits at this point) - I would suggest that not only is it inappropriate and potentially dangerous to the "innocent party" to hold-up these motorway speedsters by not moving over, but also warn that you shouldn't assume that your car speedo is necessarily accurate.Car speedometers generally over estimate your speed by up to 10% (this is part of the design specification) - so if your speedo indicates 75mph you may actually be travelling at 68-69mph and holding up other vehicles unnecessarily. The advent of GPS systems with true speed values (so long as the vehicle is travelling in a straight line) means that many drivers now have a better indicator of their speed.To extrapolate to French autoroutes - an indicated speed of 130kph is probably a true speed of nearer 118 kph - so a car passing you travelling 12kph quicker than you may not be exceeding the speed limit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 What a relief Daktari, to know that the arrogant overtskers were actually only doing 85 not in excess of 90, or 80 not 85. Or when I am going along at 70, which does happen, I am actually only doing 65 and so is everybody else, the whole world with the same defect in their speedometers regardless of make and manufacturer, and type of speedometer. Sounds like I am the only one in step again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Anglia Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 I've a few mates with gps based satnavs and scamera finders fitted in their cars.NONE of their speedos reads under, according to the gps, and all but one are about 10% out, (reading over) at 70mph. The one that is almost spot on, according to the gps, is in a Mitsubishi Evo 8Isn't that why ACPO GUIDELINES allow 10% +2mph?(Yes, I KNOW they are only guidelines, and I DO know someone who gotr done for 32mph in a 30 limit.........but the mags threw it out.And NO it wasn't me, but bro in law is a mag and told me about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alane Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Mel of course may have had in mind the twerp driving at around 55mph in the second lane on the M25 between Leatherhead and the M20 junction the other evening with little traffic in lane 1. This clown had caused a long tailback of vehicles trying to get past him as well as having a number of drivers, including large trucks, pass him on the inside. To the OP question - I suspect I am going to find out pretty soon if the UK and France have a reciprocal arrangement. Returning to the UK last week I was flashed by the speed camera on the final stretch of the motorway from Boulogne to the Channel Tunnel. I was cutting it fine but sticking to the speed limit but was flashed at an indicated 132kph. Normally my speedo corresponds to the speeds on the warning panels referred to earlier, at least at lower speeds, but maybe is just inaccurate at higher speeds. My fault for letting the speed stray over the 130 mark I know but even so it did seem a tight margin.It will be interesting to see how long the ticket takes to come through and if so what speed it shows for future reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 23, 2007 Author Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="Alane"] Mel of course may have had in mind the twerp driving at around 55mph in the second lane on the M25 between Leatherhead and the M20 junction the other evening with little traffic in lane 1. This clown had caused a long tailback of vehicles trying to get past him as well as having a number of drivers, including large trucks, pass him on the inside. [/quote]Alane - that is just the type of driver I was referring to. These middle-lane idiots usually drive well below the speed limit and seem to take great pleasure in getting in other people's way.And I would suggest that nobody should take it upon his or herself to deliberately stay in an outer lane just because they are doing the speed limit and, as judge and jury, have decided that people breaking the speed limit WILL NOT PASS! It is a matter for the person breaking the limit to face the consequences of what they are doing - not ordinary motorists on a crusade... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jc Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Trucks and vehicles towing trailers are banned from using the third lane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="Jc"]Trucks and vehicles towing trailers are banned from using the third lane.[/quote]Did someone say they weren't [8-)]It's every drivers responsibility to drive defensively and make a hazardous situation as safe as possible and if sometimes that means pulling over to the inside lane, and even slowing down, to allow a speeder(s) or nutter(s) to pass, then that is what you should do. Contrary to popular myth Gentlemen, this act does not imply that you have a small p***s !Driving is neither a competition nor a game and if more people remembered that then the roads would be safer for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 23, 2007 Author Share Posted April 23, 2007 Amen Ernie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 It's not a matter of size of any of the body parts, it's a matter of anyones convenience, as I said earlier the alternative to staying out in the middle lane when there is slower and broken traffic in the inside lane, is that the same arrogant idiots who think they have a god given right to have the road clear before them like moses parting the waves, will also not move over when you want to come back out of the inside lane at 75 mph (approximately !), so it driving defensively if you like, in defence of the right to get somewhere at the speed and convenience you decide, not what someone else does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Pugwash, if your arguments are based on a perception of driving as being one of (your) convenience and inconvenience then I fear we will have to agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 [quote user="daktari"]Car speedometers generally over estimate your speed by up to 10% (this is part of the design specification) - so if your speedo indicates 75mph you may actually be travelling at 68-69mph and holding up other vehicles unnecessarily.[/quote]This is probably right. I'm certain that my Micra turbo diesel can't really do 170 kph.[Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDee Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 If the French authorities have a reciprocal points system with UK, how does a UK license get "debited" if the holder now lives in France? It has already been established, I think on this forum, that a current UK license is 100% legal in France, even though it will show an old, not accurate UK address. If the the DVLA write to the old address, the letter will be returned. What do the DVLA do then? Informing the DVLA of a new French address means surrendering a UK license, which is not necessarily a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 If the offence was committed in France by a French resident UK licence holder, then it is compulsory to exchange the UK licence for a French one so that the points can be applied.If the offence was committed in the UK, then the UK authorities will notify the French authorities of the vehicle's French registration number so that the above procedure can be applied. If the offence was committed whilst driving a UK registered car (friend's/hired) then the UK authorities will issue an RTA S172 to the registered keeper who will then have to identify the driver. When the driver is identified as being French resident, then same procedure above would apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 24, 2007 Author Share Posted April 24, 2007 That is very interesting information SD. I guess the success or failure of an international to'ing and fro'ing system like that ever bringing the miscreant to justice, will depend on the level of rampant apathy present in the relevant police departments at any given time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDee Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 Just so Mel,I was caught in a Laser gun speed trap a month ago and fined an instant E90 for 76 Kms in a 50 kms limit. Very polite friendly Gendarme. Paid the fine and all details taken. (UK License, UK reg car but in process of changing, so CT, Quittas fiscal etc). On the receipt they give, there is a box marked Obligation d'echange du permis de conduire with a lower Perte du Points section. The top box was not ticked and the Perte du Points has had a zero written in. Maybe a month is too early to assume that thats the end of the matter but maybe hopefully, there is some discretionary element in the Change of License requirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 I think BobDee that this is the case and quite often if you are nice and polite, you'll get away with just the fine. Maybe it's more of a hassle to do the points thing? On the only occasion that a Cooperlola has been caught speeding, my o/h found himself in exactly your situation. The perfectly pleasant gendarme fined him and sent him on his way. No points and no need to exchange the licence as a result. Perhaps things will change but I still feel that a good attitude if you're caught is the sensible approach. It certainly cannot hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanary Posted April 24, 2007 Author Share Posted April 24, 2007 Absolutely right cooperlola - there are many occasions when police officers stop vehicles and their course of action will depend upon the reaction they get from the driver.Out of interest, what do the gendarmes do if you aren't carrying enough cash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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