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Hi

We are in the process of having a house built in 14.  After what seems an enormous amount of deliberation the builders have come up with a 'devis' for the provision of air conditioning.  (Here in Shetland we are used to temperatures of 10 deg in the summer so hopefully we will notice the heat in Normandy), Anyway at a 'technical meeting in December' where the subject was discussed at length I made it quite clear that we would want the machinery in the roof and not on the side of the house.  The builders accepted this. Now I see that the Devis is talking about - 1 Groupe exterieur and racordement Gaz pour climatisateur specialise agree (qualifigaz).  My questions are: 

Is this an exterior generator which will be run on gas?

Is it normal for air conditioning to be run on gas?

To my knowledge all the rest of the heating etc is going to be electric - under floor heating etc.

We will be on the phone to them on Monday morning but was just wondering if anyone had any idea what is going on.  Perhaps this is the norm and we are worrying about nothing.  We are keen to stick to what is usual  in France as we live so far away and are needing everything to go as smoothly as possible.  So far all has gone very well and I am sure this is only a minor blip.

Thanks

Michelle

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To be perfectly honest if you were sticking to what is normal in France you wouldn't be having air conditioning in 14! I'm 700km further south and nobody I know has air conditioning build into their home, just the odd moveable electrical unit they get out in July/August.

However I have heard of gas powered air conditioning before, so I wouldn't worry about it.
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Agree with Tourangelle, cant imagine anyone in France having air conditioning except possibly in extreme south, and certainly not in 14, and certainly not from someone used to the Shetlands...You'll probably be in shorts in winter in france if you are used to a shetland summer....

Save yourself a lot of money and ditch it...it wont improve the value of your property, and if its an ugly monstrosity outside it might even detract from value.

Invest the money in some good malt to keep you warm.

Bob
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[quote]Hi We are in the process of having a house built in 14. After what seems an enormous amount of deliberation the builders have come up with a 'devis' for the provision of air conditioning. (Here in ...[/quote]

Michelle, you must be nuts wanting air con in Normandy , however..  Air conditioning in simple terms means moving heat from one place to another ie inside to outside.  The machinery ie the heat exchangers have to go outside to lose the heat unless of course you want to turn the loft into an oven !  So you will have boxes and fans outside.  The system will run off electricity (lots of it) the gas will refer to the medium that is used to transfer the heat within the system.  Hope this helps . JJ
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Thanks JJ that is very helpful.  Perhaps I should explain.  My husband is disabled and one of the many  problems that this brings with it is a difficulty in regulating his body temperature.  He struggles in anything over 20 deg,  hence the need for air con. We had really wanted to avoid having anything on the outside of the house but it would appear that from what you are saying we would be daft to put the machinery in the loft.  I shall speak with the builders again on Monday .  In the meantime, if you have any more advice I would be really grateful.

Thanks again

Michelle  

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A couple of things immediately come to mind.  What sort of system are you going for, centralised or split units?  If centralised, you'll have to cool the entire house and they're nigh on impossible to regulate.  Split units are easier to control (you can turn them off in the rooms you're not using).  But bearing in mind where you are, as others have suggested, even with your husband's disability, surely you could get away with one or max two cheap and convenient mobile units?   (ie one in bedroom, one to move between kitchen/living room.) Also, give a lot of thought to the cost of running centralised and split a/c systems, be they fuelled by gas or electricity.  A/C is horrendously expensive to run.  Finally, unfortunately you may pay for the pleasure of that cool room on a hot night in more ways than one.  In my experience, they regularly trigger sinus attacks and can also aggravate asthma.  Ensure the system/units are cleaned and serviced regularly.  M
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"He struggles in anything over 20 deg"

How thick are the walls going to be on your new house? On really hot days you will probably find that if you keep your windows and doors shut to stop the hot air coming IN to your house the interior temperature won't get much above 20. Keeping the shutters closed from mid morning on very hot days also keeps the house cool.
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I hope you don't wear contact lenses or else it will be unbearable with climatisation. I have never been able to shop comfortably in our local Géant due to the heavy air conditioning as my eyes dry out very quickly.
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[quote]Thanks JJ that is very helpful. Perhaps I should explain. My husband is disabled and one of the many problems that this brings with it is a difficulty in regulating his body temperature. He strugg...[/quote]

Michelle , I expect that you have been quoted for split units ie a unit in each chosen room , connected to a compressor / heat exchanger outside, these will have fans and make some noise.  It is best if they are not in direct sunlight (it makes them cheaper to run) and not outside bedrooms etc , as the noise will be quite intrusive at night especially if you are in a quiet rural location!! The exterior units can be mounted a reasonable distance away , just involves a bit more piping and cables.  If you hav'nt checked it out yet you will need to ensure that your electricity supply is up to the requirements .  JJ
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Hello all

Firstly may I just say Air conditioning is NOT that expensive to run but it does depend on how many rooms and what size they are. If your house has 14 rooms and they are all 25m2 it would be expensive to heat or cool. If you want to cool a couple of rooms which I must say is the norm, a wall mounted split unit of 2.5-3kw duty should be ok for the average room and that would also give the same heating duty in the winter and running costs would be minimal.Portable a/c units need a window or door to vent the hot air and are noisy as all the working parts are in the room.

Hope this helps

Stephen

Refrigeration & A/C Engineer

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Hi

just a few points :

Old buildings stay cool without AC

Naturally controlled temperature is more comfortable

Air conditioning is pretty rare here on the Med

The design of the building is important : Covered terraces to keep the sun off the Southern exterior of the house, use of "shop blinds" , insulated plaster board interior, a wrinkled house finish to provide 50% shade when the house walls are in the sun, effective shutters, double glazing, windows that can be opened to allow breezes to blow through the house at night.

By treating the house as a big fridge, opening windows only at night, closing shutters as the sun moves round in the day, a modern house can stay 20C below the outside temperature.

And 20 C indoors feels pretty cool when the outside is 40C

 

Insulation is generally pretty poor in France. The standards used are way behind those of Scandinavia. The so called double glazing has panes too close together. And no one has heard of triple glazing (general use for the last 20 years in Sweden), or the increasingly popular quadruple glazing.

In the long run, it may be worth spending the AC budget on improving the building structure ?

Peter

 

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Firstly may I just say Air conditioning is NOT that expensive to run

Come again?  Let me give you some figures to show how electricity consumption increases with A/C usage where we currently live.  The $ figures are irrelevant - actually they're not, any contributions to the WJ utility bill greatly welcomed - it's the comparison that's important.

During the winter when we're only running electrical appliances (no cooker) and lights we pay around $60/month for electricity.  By May when we're running 5 split A/C units 12 hrs/day the bill triples.  By August when we're running 7 units 24 hrs a day we're looking at around $350/month.  The system is two years old, serviced monthly, filters cleaned daily.  We draw the curtains in all rooms during the day and have ceiling fans to aid air circulation. 

A/C is expensive to run and I know from long and bitter experience that electricity isn't cheap in France. 

M

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 We know people who have air-conditioning and are very satisfied with it, including the bills, and they are ordinary French people living in average properties. They don't run it for 24 hours a day, but recognise that even in properties with thicker walls, when it's 35 - 40 degrees outside, it will be most welcome. Of course, some people have greater difficulty regulating their body temperatures than others, which is why so many older people died during the 2003 "canicule".

 

 

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I am on the Med and have just had air conditioning installed in our bedrooms. Air conditioning has become much more popular in the South of France, since the canicule.

What tipped the balance in favour for me was the cold winter we have just had, when I discovered that it is quite a lot cheaper to heat with a modern reverse cycle air conditioning unit, than to use the electric panel heaters that came with the house.

Unfortunately, another consideration is that it is not a good idea in the South of France during summer, to sleep with your windows open. As being broken into and robbed as you sleep, seems to be an increasing trend. (It happened to our neighbour, who woke up to find an intruder by his bed, stealing his girlfriends watch!)

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[quote]I am on the Med and have just had air conditioning installed in our bedrooms. Air conditioning has become much more popular in the South of France, since the canicule. What tipped the balance in favo...[/quote]

Hi

Where are you in South France ?

Peter

 

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I wouldn't dream of buying a car without air con, preferably climate - so on Monday I am going out to buy a splt air con unit for the house.

The are efficient, do not cost a lot and with electicity at 3.7p peak and less than 3p off peak, will not break my bank!

Yours, 37c outside, 34c in the pool and 26c inside, it's a long way from the med but it is hot!

Well for me anyway!
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Well you’ve had lots of conflicting advice, Michelle

I think, as with so many things, that it’s difficult to generalise. We had air conditioning installed in our bedrooms at the height of the canicule in 2003 and haven’t regretted it and don’t find it too expensive. We don’t find that our thick walls (700mm) or keeping the shutters closed works if we have more than one or two consecutive hot days. I don’t like sitting in the house with the shutters closed either. I think Jeanneclaire summed it up when she said that many people have it for just when they need it. I shall be very glad of it tonight – it’s been 35 C here today.

Like Sprogster, we’ve found it useful for heating too – but then ours is only a holiday home and we don’t spent more than a week or two here in the winter.

You know your own needs and will have to make your mind up accordingly.

Hoddy

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Go for it!

I only wish we had some form of air conditioning.  It's been two very hot days (and yes, I know we've more to come in July/August), and the house is hot, despite the shutters .  The children are now sleeping in their beds with hair which is soaked through from perspiration. 

Off to buy a mobile unit this week.

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Hi

Thanks for all your comments, I have really enjoyed reading them all.  I must admit that initially I was a bit disheartened when I read some of the comments.  However, having read on I can see that we are doing the right thing.  The cost is not too much of a worry but my husbands  health is, so really we have no choice and some of the advice has been very useful. I believe it has been very hot in Normandy this last weekend.  Wish I could say the same for Shetland.  Thick mist and 15 deg max!  Never mind, will soon be sitting on our own patio in France sipping a decent glass of wine!

Thanks to you all

Michelle

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Just got back from the VAR having paid a flying visit to check on the installation of our air conditioning and pay for it.

The Hitachi units we had installed in the bedrooms are almost totally silent, including the outside compressor.

According to our French installer, new air conditioning systems have become a lot more energy efficient and quieter in the last year.

Also apparently, our units when used to heat, use half the energy of an electric flat panel heater.

All in all most impressed!

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Sprogster, your system sounds very impressive. How often do you need it servicing and cleaning?

My husband would not buy any aircon this year as he said that they are breeding grounds for bacteria. And he just pulled a face when I mentioned the hot and cold blowing ones.

I admit the cost of running it always bothered me. But now himself has brought up another reason why we shouldn't be having it.

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