Law Change Proposals - including Warning Triangles and Reflective Jackets

[Sunday Driver]

The Interministerial Committee of the Securite Routiere have announced some forthcoming measures for the protection of vulnerable road users.

Persons leaving their vehicle in the event of breakdown - from 1 July 2008, it will be obligatory for all vehicles to carry a warning triangle and reflective waistcoat for this purpose.

Cyclists riding at night - from 1 September 2008, all cyclists riding outside lit built up areas will be required to wear a reflective waistcoat.

Parents are also reminded of the need for children who are riding bicycles to be equipped with helmets, particularly those under 11 years of age.

The current 'pedestrian zone' and 'zone 30' do not currently allow a total integration of all users in urban streets, so the committee plans to introduce the concept of the 'zone de rencontre' within the code de la route where pedestrians will have priorty over all vehicles and will no longer be obliged to keep to the pavements.  The speed limit will also be reduced to 20kph. 

 

[Ron Avery]

I wondered why Hyper U have these on offer in their shops and gift catalalogue. 

 Is it one waistcoat or tabbard per car or one for every actual or potential passenger?

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Ron Avery"]

 

 Is it one waistcoat or tabbard per car or one for every actual or potential passenger?

[/quote]Well, I always carry a couple, Ron.  Seems sensible to me, even though it is not - as yet - obligatory.

On this subject - S/D, mine are orange, not yellow (somehow purloined from a railway ganger in the dim and distant past!) - does this matter?

[Sunday Driver]

I suspect that reflective means just that - colour isn't specified, nor is the required number mentioned yet.

I too have an old nicked British Rail orange waistcoat -  I used to wear it whilst marshalling on the old RAC rallies during the 60's/70's.  It's a bit faded now and it's got a big skull and crossbones in black paint on the back - not my current style, I'm afraid.....[8-|]

 

[cooperlola]

It has always interested me that the railways use orange and everybody else seems to favour yellow.  You'd think that with the huge braking distances involved on the permanent way, that the railways would know something, wouldn't you?

[Red Dwarf]

[quote user="Sunday Driver"]

Persons leaving their vehicle in the event of breakdown - from 1 July 2008, it will be obligatory for all vehicles to carry a warning triangle and reflective waistcoat for this purpose.[/quote]

Does this refer to ALL roads, or only on Autoroutes, as is the case in some countries at the moment?

[Sunday Driver]

No specific details published yet as far as I know - although they did mention autoroutes as an example of such a high risk situation.

 

[trees]

[quote user="cooperlola"]It has always interested me that the railways

use orange and everybody else seems to favour yellow.  You'd think that

with the huge braking distances involved on the permanent way, that the

railways would know something, wouldn't you?[/quote]

They do...........all the colours of the rainbow are refracted by different ammounts according to their wavelength. The refraction means scattering in conditions of poor visibility, like snow, rain, fog.

Red light is refracted through the smallest angle, so is scattered least, hence it's use a "Danger! Stop!".

Orange light is next, followed by yellow, etc.

[cooperlola]

Thanks, Trees.  I'll stick with my ganger's vest then!  Apart from anything else, it is velcro'd together, so does not get caught up on stuff either.  But it begs the question then, why is the yellow version the one which is most sold to the public?

[Bugsy]

Are motorbikes mentioned in this new legislation SD?

[Andyphilpott]

Seems to be good practice to have these anyway, but I wonder what the position will be with hired cars?

Will all hirers supply warning triangles (if not travelling with just hand baggage  will be interesting!!!!!!!!!!!!) and reflective jackets?

Andy

[PaulT]

[quote user="Andyphilpott"]

Seems to be good practice to have these anyway, but I wonder what the position will be with hired cars?

Will all hirers supply warning triangles (if not travelling with just hand baggage  will be interesting!!!!!!!!!!!!) and reflective jackets?

Andy

[/quote]

Hired a car via one of the comparison websites and ended up with one from Sixt.

We arrived late at night at Toulouse airport and was told that it was a new car that had just been delivered, with German plates.

Made our way to the car park and there were quite a few new cars all on German plates.

Inside was the triangle, reflective jackets and first aid kit. The one and only hire car I have had with this.

Paul

 

[Pickles]

[quote user="Andyphilpott"]Seems to be good practice to have these anyway, but I wonder what the position will be with hired cars?

Will all hirers supply warning triangles (if not travelling with just hand baggage  will be interesting!!!!!!!!!!!!) and reflective jackets?[/quote]

In other countries where warning triangles/reflective jackets/first aid kits are already required, hire cars tend to come already equipped with them. If a hirer nicks them then they will be charged, just as if they had removed the tools or spare wheel (or can of gunge as it is increasingly these days).

Regards

Pickles

[Sunday Driver]

As these things will be mandatory safety items, hire firms will have to supply cars fitted with them otherwise you couldn't legally drive out of their car park.

You wouldn't be expected to bring your own door mirrors, would you?  ....[;-)]

 

[MrCanary]

Hi S.D.,

Thanks for the information, it is always helpful to know what is a legal requirement and what isn't. And talking of flourescent jackets acquired from the dim and distant past, mine says 'Police' on it, do you think I'll have a problem with that? (joking)

Mel

 

[magaret]

[quote user="Mel"]

Hi S.D.,

Thanks for the information, it is always helpful to know what is a legal requirement and what isn't. And talking of flourescent jackets acquired from the dim and distant past, mine says 'Police' on it, do you think I'll have a problem with that? (joking)

Mel

 

[/quote]

 

Not in the towns, keep away from the rural bits.[:D]

[MrCanary]

Do you mean 'country gals' Magaret?

[cassis]

Following up SD's post, better make sure any existing kit conforms to the norms (CE stamped jacket, E27R stamped on the triangle).

http://www2.securiteroutiere.gouv.fr/vos-infos/presse/communiques/2-2008/CP_14-04-08.html

[Ron Avery]

As regards the jacket the CE mark actually means nothing without the supporting documentation, its just means the design is safe to use not that it meets any safety standards for visibilty or use.  Anyone buying one in the UK should see that it conform to BS EN471 class 2 standard which will also conform to the EU standard 89/686/CEE.  If you are using the old work one, some colours of HI-VI do not now conform to this standard,  they must be yellow, orange or lime green.

[Phil & Pat]

[quote user="Ron Avery"]As regards the jacket the CE mark actually means nothing without the supporting documentation, its just means the design is safe to use not that it meets any safety standards for visibilty or use.[/quote]

Are you sure about that last bit Ron?  When I was working on CE marking of products, application of the CE mark meant that the manufacturer was declaring that the product met all applicable European standards.  Has that changed?

[Ron Avery]

You are right about the theory Phil, but the point I was trying to make is that without the paperwork you don't know what standards are being met and any old piece of kit can have a CE mark, just take a look at the cheap Poundshop type  tools sold in the supermarkets that break at the first use, all have the CE mark, which in terms of quality means nothing.  A lot of the toys from China that were removed from the shelves had CE marks. The CE mark alone does not mean that it meets all or any particular safety standards only the framework agreements as there are many levels and standards and each EU country has its own.  For example a pair of protective gloves will have a CE mark, but what protection is offered from chemicals, cuts etc is determined by the relative BS in the case of the UK,  and NF in the case of France which will give the detail of the protection afforded.  There are a number of Hi-Vi vests available in the UK that may have a CE mark for the reflective qualities of the bands but they do not meet the BS EN and are not recommended for use where total visibility is essential as on transport systems.

[John L]

[quote user="Mel"]

Hi S.D.,

Thanks for the information, it is always helpful to know what is a legal requirement and what isn't. And talking of flourescent jackets acquired from the dim and distant past, mine says 'Police' on it, do you think I'll have a problem with that? (joking)

Mel

 [/quote]

You're nicked!

[Jay]

I thought there was already an obligation to carry a warning triangle and a spare set bulbs in the car? The jacket is a good idea especially on some of the dark rural road around where we live.

[Ron Avery]

As far as I know and I'm sure that SD can confirm, both requirements were advisory and a bit outdated.  The Triangle was only compulsory if you had a vehicle that didn't have hazard lights and the spare bulbs only could get you off a fine if you had a defective light.  Now the triangle and Hi-Vi will be compulsory to have in the car and to use if getting out of the car if broken down or on the hard shoulder.

[cassis]

That's my understanding, too, Ron.