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Upgrading a 12kw 20A supply


Mike1958
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We currently have a triphase 12kw 20A supply, can anyone advise whether:

  1. It is totally unacceptable to install a cooker rated at 30A even if it is on its own feed from the fuse board.
  2. Is it possible to upgrade to a 30A supply
  3. I know the charges are higher based on the KW value, are they higher for a 30A supply

We would like to install a professional range cooker (mix of town gas and electric) but have been struggling to find what we want apart from in the UK.

Many thanks,

Mike

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You don't get something for nothing with EDF; equally, you don't usually lose out. By which I mean I would expect the Abonnement for mono and triple phase supplies to be the same in respect of the total power supplied.

So a 60A mono-phase should  be the same as for a 20A triple-phase. (1 x 60 = 3 X 20)

I'm assuming the cooker you have your eye on is 3-phase because even if you had a supply rated high enough, I doubt if an electrician would be keen to install something so hefty on just one phase.

Assuming your supply lines are butch enough, EDF will happily bump you up a notch, but, of course your abonnement will step up too.

They'll be just as happy to change you to a monophase, as well.

paul

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Many thanks Paul,

I probably wasn't clear enough about the supply that we have which is that we have both a 240 and 400v supply which i gather is mono and tri respectively. I have taken the 20A rating from the edf bill which I assumed was a maximum on a single phase.

The technical spec for the cooker that we have our eye on states that it must be connected to a suitable double pole control until with a minimum rating of 30A (230/240v).

Either way it sounds from your earlier response that this is probably not suitable.

Regards,

Mike

 

 

 

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ok going to get the knocked back on this but what the hell. Miki just backed earthmover and fastrack to win 66/1 and 8/1 double if you didn`t i did so sod off .

            the little 5 or 10 or 15 number that you see in your edf meter is amps not kilowatts triphase @ 15 amps a phase gives you 45 amps total an english cooker unit needs 45 amps single phase unless you have got a 3 phase one forget it.

          I have 15 amp triphase to our house and some of my single phase machines drag 16 amp single phase on full load a pain .so change to single phase or do what i have done and changed my machines to 3 phase motors .

            I can now buy top dog machines at silly money because no one only factories has 3 phase in the uk.

             minted or what

                   Dave

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Sorry to sound picky (actually it's just me being dense),

but do you have 2 meters? On your EDF bill are you actually paying 2 abonnements?

If not then I think you just have a 3-phase supply.  Unless like Dave (above) you are planning to run heavy-duty machines you don't need 3-phase, particularly. Are you planning a re-wire? If so I'd consider changing to a single phase system.

[ the 400/220v busines is a red herring because any one of the phases + neutral gives you 220v, together = 400v]

Sorry -drifting off-topic: the abiding sin of posters in this forum -

"...The technical spec for the cooker that we have our eye on states that it must be connected to a suitable double pole control until with a minimum rating of 30A (230/240v)...."

sound like it's a single phase job to me, so - no - to feed this from a 3-phase supply would require you to have a system rated at about 150A or so. So in all probability you would be pushed into a high abonnement band (with its higher daily standing charge) simply to supply this cooker on the odd days when you had all the elements and the oven going at once. (hope that makes sense: it's a bit early for me!)

You would have to wire the cooker on a separate dedicated feed from its own fuse or (better) mini circuit breaker anyway in France.

paul

Dave,

I'm curious to know, what do you use your 3-ph motors to run? and do modern ones still have a start/run function, or is it automated these days?

p

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We also have what appears to be a triphase 12kw (3 x 20A) supply. It can be a bit annoying 'cos it effectivley behaves like 3 separate 4kw circuits in the house. Depending on combination of appliances/heaters it trips out if you get above 4kw on one of the circuits.

I reckon we would be better with a 12kW monphase supply because we would very rarely be using that amount of power at one time.

Is it simply a business of getting EDF to change it to a monophase 12kW supply or does this involve rewiring ?

Have a dual fuel range cooker in the UK (Brittania) that we are thinking of moving to France - Would this need an uprated monophase supply?

To further complicate matters I am thinking about a 'pompe a chaleur' for the swimming pool which would apparently need 3-phase supply.

Would it therefore be better just to uprate the 3 phase supply ?

Can you get different power ratings on each of the 3 phases ?

Tks in advance

Hagar

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[quote]We also have what appears to be a triphase 12kw (3 x 20A) supply. It can be a bit annoying 'cos it effectivley behaves like 3 separate 4kw circuits in the house. Depending on combination of appliances...[/quote]

 

<Is it simply a business of getting EDF to change it to a monophase 12kW supply or does this involve rewiring ?

Assuming you don't currently have any 3-phase equipment (chauffeau, for example), and your incoming cables are big enough for one to supply your total kVA, "yes" You will need your tableau de distribution completely rebuildt though and assorted rewireing done.

<Have a dual fuel range cooker in the UK (Brittania) that we are thinking of moving to France - Would this need an uprated monophase supply?

Yes.

<To further complicate matters I am thinking about a 'pompe a chaleur' for the swimming pool which would apparently need 3-phase supply.

Ah, problem, then.

<Would it therefore be better just to uprate the 3 phase supply ?

Seems like it would be your only option if you go for the pool heater.

<Can you get different power ratings on each of the 3 phases ?

No.

paul

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EDF changed our 6kW (3X10A) supply to a Monophase (1x30A) supply free of charge, they simply changed the current overload unit for a bigger one and ignored the other two phases on the supply side so, the option is there for going back to 3ph.

When checking the chauffe eau to see if it requres the 3 phase supply beware that some of them use 380V (connected between any two phases)

As stated in a prevoius post you will probably need to rewire the distribution board, this in itself is enough to make paying for the upgraded supply seem quite attractive and then you can run huge circular saws and other interseting equipment.

Regards

Peter
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Peter/Paul/ leslauriers,

Thanks for your help - looks like the simplest answer would be to uprate the existing 3 phase supply and look for a french alternative to the Brittania cooker.

Any body know of/recommend a dual fuel range similar to Brittania - available in France?.

rgds

Hagar

 

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