I love UK wiring !!

[Choochoo]

Hi everyone

I started on the wiring today, tell me they are having a laugh or that I have gone back in time to when Electricity was just discovered !! Whatever happened to fully sheathed 3 core cable for wiring a house,it exists but youre not allowed to use it for rewiring your house. Pourqoi ?             

What a wind up trying to feed three wires down a corrugated tube specially designed to be awkward and trap the wires as they travel along, and dont mention the fusebox,rubbishy plastic thing with nowhere to put all your wires. I need a stiff drink ! or two !

I feel totally clapped out and I`ve only done one circuit.

Small wonder a lot of people use UK stuff,wish I was.

John & Sue (50) 

[Bobc]

"I started on the wiring today, tell me they are having a laugh or that I have gone back in time to when Electricity was just discovered !! Whatever happened to fully sheathed 3 core cable for wiring a house,it exists but youre not allowed to use it for rewiring your house. Pourqoi ?             

What a wind up trying to feed three wires down a corrugated tube specially designed to be awkward and trap the wires as they travel along, and dont mention the fusebox,rubbishy plastic thing with nowhere to put all your wires. I need a stiff drink ! or two !

I feel totally clapped out and I`ve only done one circuit.

Small wonder a lot of people use UK stuff,wish I was."

Your posting does not really add anything helpful.

If you have a problem getting the three cores through the gaine, try using a feeder cable or even easier, use pre-wired gaine - available from any professional supplier.

Re the rubbishy plastic fuseboxes - the English, French registered electrician that I work with has worked on both residential, commercial and industrial installations in the the UK - his opinion which I would accept, is that the French system and quality of materials is far superior to the UK.

Those people using UK stuff will be installing illegal systems which will void their insurance cover.

Take a look at www.legrand.fr

Regards,

Bob Clarke
http://perso.wanadoo.fr./grindoux

[Choochoo]

Hi Bobc

Sorry,I was just letting off steam. I had had a bit of a hard day with the wiring, it kept jamming in the gaine and it took most of the afternoon to wire one 4 metre length.

I was using pre-wired gaine but it would seem it needs two people, one to pull the wire and one to feed the cables through and I was having to do it on my own. She who must be obeyed is away at the moment.

Re. the Fuseboxes, I have 4 Socket circuits and three lighting circuits coming into it, thats 7 wires of each colour to push into the hole, is there something like a multi connection which I can use inside the fusebox to connect them all ?

I am using a Fusebox already in place but never wired up,is it missing something internally ?

Thanks for the advice, I feel much better today !

 

John & Sue (50)

[Alcazar]

<<Re. the Fuseboxes, I have 4 Socket circuits and three lighting circuits coming into it, thats 7 wires of each colour to push into the hole, is there something like a multi connection which I can use inside the fusebox to connect them all ?

I am using a Fusebox already in place but never wired up,is it missing something internally ?>>

"Into the hole?"...........can't you make MORE holes? My Legrand fusebox (distibution box, really), has facilities for wires to come in from top, bottom and both sides and all you have to do is knock out another weak spot.

"is there something like a multiconnection................" There SHOULD be a multipole connector for all the earths, but each neutral, and each live should be connected to a seperate mcb, and since french mcb's are two-pole, there will be a place for each wire. Unless you have more than one circuit on one mcb, in which case, see below>>>

If you're using Legrand stuff, spare clip in  multipole connectors are available for earth, neutral and live, with screw connections.

I assume the lives and neutrals are so you can use one mcb, but have a few wires leading to , say, downstairs lights, rather than seperating the lighting into rooms with each having it's own mcb?

If you're having trouble with the distribution box, common sense says replace it with a more modern one.......you'd get more space inside, more ways for more mcb's etc, and you could split your typeA RCD from your type AC..............you DO have both, don't you?

I had to buy all new, although I am rewiring mine a bit at a time. My old system had ONE 16A cartridge fuse "protecting" the entire property, and NO earth

Alcazar

 

 

[Bobc]

"Sorry,I was just letting off steam. I had had a bit of a hard day with the wiring, it kept jamming in the gaine and it took most of the afternoon to wire one 4 metre length."

John,

We all have bad days!

My reply was probably misleading.

By pre-wired gaine I did not mean the empty gaine with a thin wire pull. Pre-wired gaine is available in large reels with either 1.5mm or 2.5mm live, neutral and earth cables inserted. It is available from professional outlets such as Cobatri who are more than happy to supply domestic customers.

Some of the larger bricos are also starting to stock it at very inflated prices.

Re your distribution board - as Alcazar has commented, with a modern Legrand type board you should have no problem in bringing in all your cables. From my own experience, plan the size of board that you need then buy the next size up to allow for future expansion. Legrand also make very wide, deep plastic trunking that you can fit to the wall and then mount the distribution board on this and hide all the gaines coming in both above and below the board.

If you are finding the electrical installation hard work, then my best advice would be to pay a French registered electrician to do it for you and spend your time on more interesting jobs.

Good luck with your project!

Regards,

Bob Clarke
http://perso/wanadoo.fr/grindoux

[Anton Redman]

Whereabouts are you ? Around us Haute Vienne it is too expleative delealted cold to work with concreate or wiring today. If you are within a few miles why don't you come over and have a look ?

As far as I am aware there is no bar to using French three core cable inside gaine. Threading it was a job from Hades. Stood on top internal beam, dropped gain down to cellar and threaded wires through with aid of gravity.

I recently added two more disjointers to a pre cabled box and even then with only one spare space there is loads of space.

[Truffleman]

Yes but with UK wiring, threaded thru' joists, stapled and plastered in, it is impossible to add any additional wiring without major problems. Now even more expensive with the necessary use of a Certified Electrician or having the work inspected by the local Building Inspector under UK Building Regulations.

Same procedure in France (technically) but with the correct use of wires in "gaines" and the use of a proper "tir-fils" (a flexible reusable nylon draw wire, about €6 to €10)that is easily fed into the installed "gaine" and the wires attached and pulled through. Check on the cable capacity, number and size for the "gaine". Make sure no sharp wire ends can catch on the "gaine", I alwaysfold the wires back so that the rounded insulated wire(s) is/are facing the direction of "pull".

The real problem I found with the French wiring is wiring up the Legrand double sockets; so fiddly with my fat fingers, the stiff 2.5mm wire, lack of space and the cold!!!! I'm now trying to thaw them out from the inside with a dwindling supply of Scotch. Cheers, everyone.

[Ianhaycox]

I've found the easiest way to draw gaine is to do it outside. Cut the gaine to length and tie one end of the pull wire to a post or door handle. Walk in a straight line laying out the gaine as you go. At the far end tie in, fold back, tape up etc. the wires. Once secure hold the gaine in one hand and feed the cables through with the other whilst walking away from the fence post, door handle.

All that said I nearly always buy pre-drawn cable now. The only time I thread my own is for light switches. A purple and red for a simple switch, or two oranges and a red for a double switch.

[Choochoo]

Hi everyone

Thanks to all for their helpful replies, I think i have got the hang of threading the wires now.

Thanks for the invite Anton,we are near Gorron just where 50 meets 53, I think you are too far away, anyway the missus is in England with the car so certainly too far to walk !

Can anybody tell me the difference between a Type A and a Type AC protector diferentielle and which one is used for which type of circuit.

Also one other point, can I feed one RCD from the output of another or is this going to upset things

I was also reading that low voltage supplies, e.g. for 12v Ceiling lights, must use a thicker wire than would be normal for lighting. I have a run of about 5 metres from the transformer which means I must use 6mm wiring ! is this right.? I am reluctant to mount the transformers near the ceiling lights in the void as most ones I have had before seem to burn out transformers at least once a year.

Thanks to all

 

John & Sue (50)

[Alcazar]

Can anybody tell me the difference between a Type A and a Type AC protector diferentielle and which one is used for which type of circuit.

One of them, the type A, I THINK, is for use where DC currents might be found, so anything with a heavy-duty motor, washer, tumble drier etc plus induction hobs. The other one is for all other circuits. "Maitiser l'Electricite" defines which is which, as does L'Electricite Pas a Pas" available from Leclerc, excellent diagrams. Mine are wired correctly, bit without looking, I'm blowed if I can remember.  Interestingly, only ONE type sems to be readily available in the UK!

Also one other point, can I feed one RCD from the output of another or is this going to upset things

Why on earth would you want to do this? I think it would be frowned on anyway. All RCD's ought to be fed from the main incoming cables, or parafoudre if fitted. There would be nothing AFAIK to stop you running thick cable into the first RCD, and looping from it's INPUT to the next one and so on. All my feeds are either busbar or 10mm sq inside the fusebox, apart from the earth, which WAS 10 mm sq, and is now 16mm sq after a French plumber advised I changed it.

Alcazar 

[Plato comes homePlato]

Hi. I am an electrical fitter mechanic and engineer in both electrical and electronics.

Oh Boy!!! The English trait of knowing nothing and pretending to know everything never-endingly persists....It's  the syndrome that suckers around Rochechouart for example have faced with a Pommie local female 'real estate agent' (well known to the Police) so ignorent and slippery as to be constantly faced with the law...are encountering in helping her to have her own free works done iin exchange for recommended donkeys doing trade work for trusting expatriots..and she is only one!!

I add....If you english would stop trying to use french expressions you neither understand nor which, if actually "French"  actually mean anything the some resolution might be possible.

This whole file here is nonsense, other than occasionally intelligent gems like "make another hole".

I cannot believe that such ignoramus' are actually attempting electrical works..it is so absurd that such a dangerous energy form would be approached by such communal and personal ignorence.

The best advice given on the site was get a French electrician, yet I recently repaired )after a complete rewire) the most essentially dangerous installation one can install  by an otherwise very good french Tradesman..if they can stuff-up..imagine how you can,.

Do I think I am "shxt-hot. yes I do and I have the runs on the board.....I know what I am talking about and I see this penny pinching ignorence from the English trying to "save money" and "be admired" year after year on forums...and in real life in France.........something needs to be siad and belted into the space between your ears forever...

Why should pommies leave literally thousands of defective houses in France for other poor mugs simply because they are too mean and too stupid to get proper tradesmen to do their work.

Get this if you can grasp the point ..being ENGLISH in France guarantees you probably DO NOT have a clue about almost anything..you are "babes in the woods" and yet you go on stuffing up renovations and seeking support from uneducaed people whilst being praised by other idiots for so doing.

I am a very technical and generous helper but when I see sites like this waffling nonsense as though people think they have a clue I feel like just leaving you to your suicidal tendencies and walking away. Nonsense like "16 mm sq earthing" in domestic premises simply means that either you or the french electrician haven't a clue...although there is nothing 'dangerous' in using 16mm squ earthing.....the problem simply is that you are being approached by fragmented and therefore ignorent thinking and this could be quite dangerous to heed.

It is not unwise in single phase installations to use 16mm sq sub mains but the earthing needs only to be 10mm squ.maximum No technical reason exists to go higher than that.

Your local French electricity supply Engineer may well speak English and help you,,why you don't ask him/her rather than cast pearls here and get off over silly and technically ignorent replies ..........God only knows why you  would .."loneliness" perhaps ?? in the meantime if you seriously want engineering advice as opposed to a general chat about a serious subject with a view to perpetuating ignorence then email me on [email protected]

I'll help or redirect you.cheers

[Will]

Don't you just love Australians with balanced views (i.e. a chip on both shoulders)?

[Alcazar]

Hmmmmmmm

I frequent one or two BBS's, and often come across posts like Plato's. Ill mannered doesn't even start to describe these people. Still, being Australian, Plato, I guess you have an excuse? Your post WAS rather full of hate of the English, but then, most Aussies are jealous of us, so hate us, why should you be any different?

As the poster who talked about 16mm sq earth, perhaps I can be permitted to respond?

The guy who RECOMMENDED me to change to 16mm sq is a qualified french electrician, as most of their plumbers are.

He DID say that 10 sq mm was OK, but 16 would be better.

Since french regs state that the earth MUST be at least the same size as the live/neutral conductors, why would you use 10 sq mm earth if 16 sq mm feeds are in use?

Feel free to respond with another load of vitriol, Plato. After all, you're hidden behind a computer screen, so why not?

Alcazar

[Simon]

I'd be a bit more careful with statements like "Do I think I am "shxt-hot. yes I do..." while being so rude to others Plato. You are not an expert in everything and you may need some help from the rest of us on this forum in the future. Still they are your bridges to burn.

regards

S

[Dick Smith]

"Do I think I am "shxt-hot. yes I do"

And all this verbal diarrhoea proves it...

[Alcazar]

[quote]"Do I think I am "shxt-hot. yes I do"And all this verbal diarrhoea proves it...[/quote]

I'm going to have to stop reading your posts, Dick. That's the second one that's caused me to spray the keyboard with coffee

Alcazar

[PaulC<P><IMG src="http:forums.livingfrance.comimagesline.gif"><BR>Paul, Debbie and Josh, <BR>London & Dept 24<BR><a target=_blank href="http:www.les-brandes.net" target=_blank>http:www.les-brandes.net<A><BR><P>]

 "I had had a bit of a hard day with the wiring, it kept jamming in the gaine and it took most of the afternoon to wire one 4 metre length."

Get youself a draw wire, it's a long thin steel or nylon strip that winds onto a reel but springs out flat when unwound, you push this through the conduit then tape the wire to the end and pull it and the wires back through - brilliant bit of kit, worth every penny of the £5.99 it will cost you.. 

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Conduit_Steel_Index/Draw_Tape_Nylon_20M/

Paul

[Plato comes homePlato]

Hi..gee I sort of accidentally came back...vaguely to see if resident electrical "know almost nothing...alcazar" or whatever the name is had answered my question re earthing in reply to his blustering assertions gained from the plumber...a fine source... Obviously he hasn't a clue even about the issues he raises himself...I stand by..even more firmly now..that people ignorent of electrical installation technology should employ a tradesman. This is not "do it yourself" stuff like some primitivity in crystal sets from BOP but lethal situations.

In the meantime I will help anyone seriously interested in wiring matters, reluctantly in one way but only rather than that they electrocute theselves or others somewhere along the track...

I read the whole site thoroughly and realised that a serious inquiry has been met by some serious attempts to help the guy who asked the question, one chap perhaps showed some sort of hope with an electronics background and I offer to him out of politeness that I am a Ham Operator ..unlimited call  and was member of IEEE.Love to chat with you mate..email me if you want..ok...

Sadly profound ignorence has also been a part of the general melee of this site but .....then none of you has a trades background..nor do french plumbers "usually" as electricians...so just throw that suggestion from one of you into the loonie basket..a tradesman is NOT someone with certain dispensations for example to fit hot water services. Don't make me laugh with cretinous responses please....the answers supposedly attributed to the "plumber/electrician" are at about fifty times the level of your informant and still prattle.....and Simon I DON"T need you...but do appreciate your interest....perhaps looking at your photo we could discuss violence and post Ni-dan theory.

Good advice has been given on using a "snake"...perfectly rational EXCEPT better to avoid the steel ones mentioned around active switchboards..most nylon ones aren't worth a cracker in serious work but for short lengths like a few metres unless much convoluted they would be fine. It occurs to me that using occsional "french technical terms in a serious english converstaionis ..as basil Fawlty observed 'presumptious"  better to stick with the English .....

The use of building wire in conduit is largely a factoring of current matters when concerned with the passage of air in keeping insulation temperature down and in some cases to do with polyphase interaction. I am happy to explain this to you personally questioner just email me....

The use of circular tps and other laid up cables as opposed to flat TPS (a la UK and Australia for example) may simply be a choice by Authorities. Using conduit and building wire would be much simplified by the use of 7/067 for example instead of single core cables which are for example banned in Australia...too easy to nick in installation and break thereafter.

Re RCD's if you seriously require expert advice then, again  questioner or anyone else seriously interested,  email me personally.

Alcazar questions your RCD perspective however the question is not only rational but an 'everyday one. Let's look at this case....I have an installation in which I have a number of 30 mA Rcd's.I want to protect ALL my installation in the event of say a fire..I use a 100mA RCD say after the main switch and from it I feel off to unprotected and protected circuitsor only the unprotected)...noting that my total installation has cumulative leakages from various circuits through each protected sub circuit and this reduces the effectiveness of subcircuit RCD's and also again accumulates to reduce the effectiveness of the 100mA RCD.

I have however these unprotected circuits which may cause even more mayhem than RCD subcircuits which will individually switch out in the event of (just say) a fire causing one of several leakage possibilities..but my unprotected circuits can cause grave damage and fuel the fire in a sense..so...I protect myself using a main RCD of say 100 to 300 mA and may well choose to have my subcircuit rcd's fed through it as well...thus an RCD feeds an RCD...get the idea my mocking friends there? or do you have something expert to say? if not say nothing or run and "phone a friend"

In the normal state of say domestic installations a lot of disputation has taken place over the years concerning leaving circuit such as lighting refrigerators and stoves and hot water OFF the RCD protection..little real reason exists other than in power factor corrected lighting installations where misleading leakage can occur as it did/does with early TV's. The use of independant RCD's largely does away with such arguments over cumulative leakage affecting a "main" rcd....I always use combined RCD/CB's.

To supply all the domestic  RCD circuitry from say a 100mA "main" rcd can be viewed as extravagant or sensible but whatever the thought there is NO problem feeding an  RCD from an RCD so long as the secondary is lower in leakage actuation than the primary..my simplified answer is not the whole story.

To use one RCD to cover all circuits is false economy....better to use a 30mA rcd on each subccircuit and by the way these trip out between 23 mA and 30mA..few exceed the leakage current.

Unlike alcatraz or whoever he is.....the regional electrical engineer in south of France found my recent system discussions with him to be valued enough to do considerable work for my client FOC. Any of you who think I don't know what I am talking about are welcome to your ignorence and playing silly games amongst yourselves giggling and sniggering ......abuse all you like but don't expect to gather any points from misleading earnest and sincere questioners like this person because if you try to dump ignorence on them and I am around I will cane you...so far I have been a gentleman. The comment by willy the conqueror was spiteful and ignorent because he has no expertise...but he IS after all your guru and you must listen..in the meantime if you want expert advice, ask me..but don't try to waste my tim..only sincere people please.

The matter of france's perversely functioning electrical misconcepts will be on my agenda for next trip and I hope eventually to see France going more sensibly with electrical reqirements...

Finally....it is this ingrained english ignorence which is hidden under waves of bluster which irks me to remind the pommies who they are...as does the concept that somehow anyone from across the channel who goes to france is an instant expert and knows more than the french. Almost all your law (not Roman) came from your antecedent's defeat in 1066 by Normans, not Francs, who spoke french but in the more southern regions is a much more obstinate and  difficult French subject.

The French widely resent you as well as, resultingly,  other immigrants because you don't fit in and you think you are superior to them and you are changing their culture for one with not much to offer THEM. In fact you have seriously depleted their property culture and social realities as , like with the Raj etc, you come to how them the great light and the great game.

Elsewhere I spoke of the destructon of Spain and Portugal for greed through these fould investment units which are completely out of place.....so fostered by English investors.

Ok some are some are not of that "this is my moment of glory..so  to teach the French how to suck eggs " immigrant and I accept that..I love some of the pommies I have met.... nevertheless both as homeowners and as tradesment their trades skills range from good through to non existent and worse...and they ought to just wake up to themselves, get a social conscience and use the appropriate French tradesmen rather thanblunder through the restorations using people who don't have a clue eit

[Alcazar]

Plato wrote:

because if you try to dump ignorence on them and I am around I will cane you...so far I have been a gentleman

Pluto, you are a grade-A prat

Anytime you'd like to TRY caning me, arrange a meet!

I've said it before, I'll say it again: prat!

And you STILL haven't answered the question about the earthing. Probably too busy teaching the engineer for the whole of the south of France a thing or two, eh? Muahahahahaha!

Alcazar

Edited to remove words that may offend others

[Will]

Plato, you remind me of a lecturer in electrical installation who taught me once (yes, I do have some background in the subject). His mantra was that there are four ways of doing everything - the right way, the wrong way, everybody else's way, and his way. Needless to say the only way worth bothering with, according to him, was his way.

When questioned by any clever dick about why his way was different from the right way he would reply that the questioner had a point, and there were 'right' ways taught by other lecturers and stated in the regulations and the text books, and they were probably OK, but 'his' way was better.

Stangely enough where 'his' way differed from the 'right' way generally concerned security, and methods of connection, of earth wires and links. You weren't that man by any chance? (somewhere in Hampshire, 1965 if my memory serves me right).

As we all know, France is a big country, and there are often different names for the same thing, and different answers to questions about how things are done here (and I refer to things in general, not just building issues). Too many people who use forums like this have difficulty in accepting that other people's answers, or experiences, can be equally valid as their own.

[Ian Hoare<br>All the best<br>Ian<br>La Souvigne Corrèze<br>http:www.souvigne.com]

Hi all,

I've not read through this entire thread, as two or three ill mannered and stupid posts from Plato were as much as I could take.

However, I would like to say that although I do agree that there are many aspects to UK electrical installation rules that are better than those used in France, using unprotected cabling is not one of them if that is still permitted there.

Using corrugated gaine is perfectly simple if done the right way.

1 make sure you pre-cut it to the right length. Make sure also that you are using the right diameter for the number and gauge of the wires you're hoping to run.

2. Make sure you cut all the individual wires to the right length - at least 20 cms longer than the gaine, though up to a metre longer is not stupid sometimes. Thread a cabling needle through the gaine, (this is a very heavy gauge nylon device, usually 5, 10 or 20 m long, with an eye swaged to one end. You can get them at any professional suppliers.

3. Now strip the insulation from one end of each wire and attach all of them through the eye of the needle. If you bend them through and wrap a bit of insulating tape round the tail, you've got a pretty solid attachment.

4. Now, if you're trying to feed more than about 3 metres, liberally slather some special lubricating gell down inside the gaine.

5. Try to straighten the gaine as much as possible, and ideally two handed, pull the needle out of the other end, simultaneously feeding in the bundle of wires in at the other. If working single handedly, it can be easier to use about a metre excess of each wire, and fix the far end, so that you can pull the whole bundle fairly straight, and in effect push the gaine over, while simultaneously keeping tension on the needle. From time to time, add a little lubricating glop at the wire end.

That's it. Now you can feed the gaine where you want it. To try to feed cables/wires through a gaine that is wandering all over hell's half acre past beams, round rocks and so on is a mug's game.

One last thing. If you are entirely rewiring a house, especially if you intend it to let it out, or use ot for B&B, it is likely that you will have to pass a "consuelle" a safety visit from a representative from EDF, and they are extremely strict. If you don't, your house insurance will probably be void. I believe that recent changes in the rules insist that TV and telephone points MUST be provided in every room (though I doubt that one would have to include kitchen, bathroom and loo ;-) ).

 

[Punch]

Most of you may already know that I am an electrician working in France and whilst in principle Ian's advice is very good, in day to day practice most electricians working here would install the gaines during the construction process and come back at a later date to wire them, or wire them immediately after installation. The biggest problems when trying to pull wires through gaines are;

The gaine moves with the wires and buckles up, this is why it is easier to pull through once the gaine is held solid in a plastered wall, and fixed correctly.

Too many right angle or  more acute bends, and not enough "boitiers de derivation" (junction boxes) have been used in the installation; gaines should follow gentle curves where possible; Basically If the gaine is not re-wireable, then it has not be installed correctly so if you are running it all over the place as Ian has mentioned around beams etc, then this is not generally good practice, but hey, we are all guilty of doing that

Too many wires are passed through the gaine, - there are limits and I won't bore you with the cable factors but they should be only one third occupied by wires. As an example a maximum of only 4 x 2.5mm wires are allowed in a 20mm gaine or 3 x 1.5mm wires in a 16mm gaine. If this advice is followed then most wires pull through ok.

You can also buy gaines prewired, but you will pay through the nose if you buy from a DIY outlet. Most gaines have a draw wire already installed. The nylon ones are weaker than the steel galvanised draw wires and the tensile strength is very high in the latter. Tying on your wires is a very important part and needs the use of a smooth and carefully tied joint, with an OBLIGATORY covering of insulation tape. Some gaines are pre-lubricated, but It will rarely be necessary unless the run is long and the wires are kinked or not unwound straight.

In the trade we buy special drum rollers that take the coils of cable which unroll freely as you pull from the other end. Although I have employees, I do not often have the luxury of another pair of hands and have adapted to manage this task alone most times.

If I may just correct one small but significant point about the post above, The Consuel are an independant inspectorate and not part of the EDF. The EDF will require a Consuel visit usually on new installations, re-connections and major renovations. I say "usually" because like most things here, it varies from dept to dept and can even be down to the individual EDF reprensentative on the day in question as to whether he wants you to get an attestation Consuel. You can also get one on a voluntary basis if you want.

Finally and most importantly, I am in total agreeance with Ian about Plato's posts, which is probably one of the reasons I have withheld from posting on some threads. I can't understand why he has been allowed to continue on here. if I was moderating he would have been given a permanent "red card" long ago. This Forum would be a better place without him. There are a very high number of users here who also use the Total France forum - that's where I'm thinking of heading too, if things aren't sorted out here soon

Best regards,

Paul

 

 

[Ian Hoare<br>All the best<br>Ian<br>La Souvigne Corrèze<br>http:www.souvigne.com]

Hi Paul,

Thanks very much for your comments. I fully accept that professional electricians (I've seen them do it) tend to lay gaines and then wire them. However, thanks for agreeing that in difficult runs, my method is easier!! I live in an area where many houses are stone built, and nice straight runs are in the realms of fantasy. I guess to some extent that coloured my thinking.

My recommended method of running gaines was based upon the practical difficulties I'd seen in pre-positioning them and then wiring, and is one that works with the  minimum of professional kit. The pulling needle isn't exactly hard to find, use or expensive.

As for Plato's comments. If you want someone to back a formal complaint to the moderators, I'd be delighted to do so. His posts are aggrsssive, racist flames, and are specifically forbidden in the FAQs. He's long on aggressive put downs and short on real help. he would not be missed IMO.

Thanks very much for your correction about the Consuel. I'd forgotten that they weren't part of EDF.

 

[Iceni]

Late to the party as usual but here goes.

UK regs are irrelevant - we are in France.

Whether UK methods are superior is irrelevant, we are in France.

My experience of wiring is limited but has worked so far (luckily I have 2 pairs of hands). Our "gaine" has a nylon or thin wire which sometimes we use to pull through our 3 or 4 cables but depending on length is often not necessary. We have not tried putting the gaine in place first and then pulling/pushing cables round corners etc because that seemed illogical and too much like hard work. There have been occasions when I wished that we were using UK T&E but, maybe because I'm a boring old ****, I accept that I am in France where things are different, not necessarily better or worse, just different.

As regards the unhelpful and inflammatory postings of our convict cousin, why is anyone surprised ? My personal views on "one strike and you are out" as a means of control have been stated on many occasions but this is LF's board and they do it, or not, their way. As with French wiring I have a choice of acceptance or move on.

Now to enjoy the sunshine.

John

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