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Does a devis mean that is the final price?


adventure
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I have signed a devis given to me by a artisan that was recommended to me, and  work has begun in my house.  I am happy with the quality of work, although the progress is rather slow.

My question is:

are there any reasons why the amount the devis is for may change (if no further work is agreed on)? 

I understand there may be a small increase, for example, due to a change in the rate of T.V.A. on materials which is unavoidable. 

The reason I ask is I have spoken to another local Englishman who used this same artisan.  At the end of his job the amount required added more than a quarter to the original devis.  The Englishman paid the extra, probably for a quiet life, although he claims he couldn't see what it was for.  His aquaintance told him it was "probably for increased labour". 

Also what if the artisan takes it upon himself to, say, fit a more expensive bath suite than quoted for.  With no written or verbal contract can I be made to pay?

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Hello

The artisans who frequent the forum should comment but in my experience (with mainly french artisans) I have never been charged more than the devis, which is the whole point of having one in my opinion!  I can't see that the artisan would have any grounds for an increase unless there was a catch all in the devis which stated if the job turned out to be more work than originally thought he could make a further charge.  If this kind of clause were present you should ask for a new devis to cover the extra cost should this situation arise. 

Panda

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The devis and the invoice should have had enough detail he should have been able to work out exactly what he was paying extra for. Without seeing both it is very difficult to comment. I the Englishman suppllied measurements for a roof which turned out to be wrong thenI would expect him to be liable for the extra
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In my own experience the devis have been pretty accurate but all the measurements etc were done by the builder in question so the bill matched the devis word for word.  He did put only 2 lucarnes in the devis in spite of there being 3 on the plan so he did the third for nothing.  The only other change I encountered over a long project was also in my favour when it turned out they had over-estimated the amount of insulation material required.
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As an Artisan.....

A devis, unless it is something else (such as a "devis estimatif"), is a fixed price for the job. HOWEVER, most of us put comments like "except for difficulties in realisation or changes by the client", as a cover-all for underquoting....

A devis over 150€ must be detailed - very detailed. An invoice, unless it simply says "per my devis of.." and charges the same amount as the devis, must be equally detailed. Compare them and ask why if they vary.

In theory, any changes (by you or the Artisan) requires the devis process to be repeated, although it usually never happens.

If I thought that changes would increase a devis by 25%, I would certainly discuss it with the client. If I had (for example) underestimated the time needed and wanted to increase it, I would talk to the client, but I doubt if I could force him to pay up.

 

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Well, ours has certainly changed. But mainly because of things that have been added or changed as we have progressed. There have been a few things that have worked out cheaper but mostly more expensive. [:(]

I am very impressed if not amazed with those of you that have been involved with a renovation of an old property and had everything covered exactly in the devis, including the artisans.

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[quote user="Anton Redman"]The devis and the invoice should have

had enough detail he should have been able to work out exactly

what he was paying extra for. Without seeing both it is very difficult

to comment. I the Englishman suppllied measurements for a roof which

turned out to be wrong thenI would expect him to be liable for the

extra[/quote]

is there an 'f' missing in this, Anton ? If not I can't get it to make sense.

p

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Hi WJT

In our case the devis have been for things that are fairly easy to quote for and get right, that may be why we have never had an increase.  We have had 4 new heatings systems, 5 rewires, the rest of the work we've done ourself.  I think an electrician who knows exactly how many plugs to wire etc should be able to accurately quote, same goes for a plumber, they know exactly what you want, number of radiators type of boiler etc. so there sould be no need for any changes. 

Panda

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Hi Panda, that makes sense and so does Anton's comment on doing all of the grunt work. [:)] As it happens, we are having some changes with the electrics and plumbing as well but most of the changes are with the macon. We are now using the devis as a very loose guide. [:-))]
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The devis should be signed by the artisan and the client; it then becomes a legal contract and what you see is what you pay. Any alterations to the original devis have also to be signed and attached.

Er.... one point, adventure. What do you mean by changes in TVA on materials?

Perhaps your artisan has priced his works at 5.5% and should've have priced them at 19.6% (There are two rates of TVA applicable to renovations - loosely 5.5% is charged by the artisan for renovating a building which was habitable at one time. 19.6% is charged for converting barns into habitable accommodation, installing swimming pools, adding terraces etc. There are of course variations. see http://www.conseils-infos-batiment.fr/fiscalite/tva-5,5.php)

If this is not the case, can you elaborate?
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