2 Families on the move

[Teamedup]

[quote user="riff_raff"]

Yes we intend to move perminently, so does this rear anything ugly ?

We are very close friends and have been for years, myself (Mr Riff) and Mr Raff  [:D] have fished in France for over 15years so know most of what is needed to make the business grow (we hope).

Is it a bad thing to have your assetts governed by the French ?      we dont want to earn millions just want a better life for our children and to make a living through what we enjoy as a pastime.

Thanks all.

Mr Riff

[/quote]

 

You 'know' that do you. You know how french education works do you. I just cannot let such a comment be. You know that there is everything in France that the UK has, I'm on about the 'bad' things that concern kids that so many seem to state as things to get away from.

And yes, learn french ASAP.

[riff_raff]

No we dont know it all that is why we have posted on here!

If there are bad points then please feel free to let us know, as this is why we have asked questions in the first place.

There are good and bad in which ever life we all lead that goes without saying, but we all have chioces that only we can make.

If you are only posting on my thread to pick me up on nitty gritty points, id rather others gave me advice thanks.

We are just normal people asking normal questions and not here to be got at thanks.

Mr Riff [:(]

[Dick Smith]

TU's point, and it is one she and many other posters have made many times on all forums, is that France is not all idyllic, and that the education system particularly is unlike that of the UK, especially in that children are not treated as individually as would be the case here. They are expected to conform to a pre-existing model, and some find that hard. Older (school-age) children do not all react positively to the experience. I personally know of one boy whom I would have put into a top group in the UK being virtually expelled from a French school for poor achievement. No-one was very interested in seeing what his needs were.

The level of bureacracy is high compared to the UK and you must expect to find things being done in very inefficient ways, and yet there will be penalties when you get the process wrong. There is crime, disadvantage, urban sprawl and decay in France. You need to factor in all of those things.

That said, I am a holiday homer and I love the time I spend deep in rural Normandy. But I wouldn't try to bring my kids up there.

[KathyC]

I think that what Teamed Up is referring to is your assumption that your children will have a better quality of life in France than in England. Perhaps if you could post your thoughts on why you assume this to be so then people can confirm or contradict (probably both!) your thinking on the subject.

[riff_raff]

Thank you Dick for your comments and we take them onboard as people views are a valuable source of info that we dont have to much of at the moment.

I have had friends that have lived there for a few years and have heard some right horror stories, ones i hope wont happen to us, but im sure there is a workable way to a positive move there.

Im sure there are some plenty of minuses and we want to hear them but surely there are pluses as well?

Thanks.

Mr Riff [:)]

 

[Dick Smith]

I don't want to be TOO Eeyoreish about it, but in general you should put the good things aside for the moment and look for the nasties - you won't be too upset if something unexpectedly nice happens!  When you know the bad bits, and you have decided you can live with them, then the good bits will seem all the better!

[riff_raff]

Hi Kathy, im going to live to regret posting on here i can see it already.[8-)]

The reason i said that comment was because at the moment we both work very hard and to be honest have had enough of working for other people, the job we want to do is one we are both very very passioate about and believe we have something to offer, we both have friends that have tryed this before and failed but we think we know why. (we hope)

 Also the schooling here changes and at the moment children are not taught languages like they used too, i think they need to be biligual to achive maximum potentual in the future,in our area if your child is one grade below what they think is necessary they wont even teach them a language, or the chance anyway,  the area we live has also changed and not for the better! its gone downhill fast.

Yes im sure France has this too and again thats why we are asking questions, surely asking is better than going blindly into the abiss and not knowing a thing.

Regards

Mr Riff

p.s   thanks again Dick, posted at same time..... believe me we are not taking things lightly at all, we are all the time looking on the darkside of things but you can only ask the same questions so many times to each other and thats is why we have come on here. Sorry if we have upset anyone its not our intention.

[Russethouse]

I think the best thing to do now is to take the seperate parts of your question and post in the dedicated forum sections: Disabled Allowance in Health, Inheritance in legal etc.

Also it is worth while using the forum search facility.

The best of luck [:)]

 

[Patf]

Apart from the complications of owning a property and business in a parnership, for which you need advice from a french notaire, I would think your main concern is will you be able to earn enough to support your families? Have you spoken to other people who have a fishing lake business? If you Google " France - fishing lake business" you will find a few references to british-owned enterprises and they may be able to give useful advice if you contact them. A few years ago there was a long discussion on this forum about several people planning to jointly buy a large french property. One of the "Jon"s or "John"s. I don't know what became of the idea but sadly all lost in the depths of the ancient archives. Pat.

[Dick Smith]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not the least bit upset!

[KathyC]

Hi

As someone who hasn't moved over yet I still have some pinkish glasses on and I do understand anyone's unhappiness about the English education system. However I know that many people aren't happy with the system in France and I'm sure that they'll tell you all about it!

I often think that what many people are looking for is a move from the town/city to the country rather than from the UK to France . Personally, I feel  that it might be worthwhile asking yourselves the question "If we could buy the country property/lake/renovation project/guest house for the same price in the UK as we can in France, would we still want to move over?". If the answer is "no" then I would think very carefully about your plans. A move to the country is a difficult enough proposition without adding in the extra complications of a foreign country; unless you really love the idea of moving to France (and accept that your idea may well change with more knowledge) then I would think and think again.

[Chrisb]

Hi Mr Riff

Don't worry, I'm sure no-one is upset!! I'm afraid one of the worst things you can do on a forum such as this is to post things like 'better quality of life for the children' 'the UK is going down hill' -,many people think that they shouldn't really be reasons for wanting to move to France and they usually get somebody's goat, although I must say, I think you have had some pretty decent replies, especially from Dick.
Browse these forums, ask lots of questions (put on your flak jacket!), prepare yourself for all eventualities, try and have a contigency plan in place and enough money to get you going, then, if it's really what you want to do, just do it!! There will always be those who have had bad experiences in education, in business etc etc and, quite rightly, they will want to pass them on. Remember, the people who post on here are only a very small proportion of those who actually live and work in France................people do come over here and make a go of things, and there is no reason why you shouldn't do the same. Your children may, or may not get on well at school - I would say that they are all still of an age where they should manage pretty well.
Good luck and keep posting those questions!!

Regards

Chris

[Teamedup]

If you read lots and lots of threads in the Health Section or the Education Section, and all the rest, you will see lots of advice and points of view.

I just don't like comments about 'a better life'......... just like that. I don't see any of the kids I have seen grow up in France having 'a better life' than my friends kids in the UK. In fact my friends and families kids in the UK are generally far more successful.

And maybe you will say, well, we are escaping the rat race, but the fact is that young people in France find themselves equally unable to afford to buy housing, not, might I add, aided by all the flush foreigners coming in pushing up prices in the regions so favoured by the brits............ and I won't even discuss unemployment amongst the young here.

I just see a country good things, bad things and these jolly happy posts full of excitement about somewhere I just don't recognise, m'agace sometimes.

 

AND it is my view that to live in France one needs a pretty thick skin. The french, are absolutely wonderful at sharp, acid comments and insisting on 'their' point of view, valid or not, real experts they are and personally once I got the hang of it all, well, I think it is great.

[LanguedocGal2]

[quote user="riff_raff"]

things but you can only ask the same questions so many times to each other and thats is why we have come on here.

[/quote]

This is not targeted specifically at you but a lot of people who write into this forum, saying that they are moving to France for a ‘’better life’’. These same people then go on to ask the most BASIC questions about the country. When I read these questions, I always wonder how anyone can declare they will have a ‘better life’ in a foreign country when they know SOD ALL about the country and its systems?

I’m sorry but I do not consider years of going somewhere on holiday as a good basis for deciding that that country and systems can offer you a ‘better’ way of life. A cheaper house, better weather, better beaches maybe, but not necessarily a better life for one’s family with all the variables that it entails.

When you move here, you may have a great life and everything could work out for you but the whole experience could also be a disaster.  You will never know until you try it

You should not only be asking these questions to each other (I’m assuming you are talking about your partners), France is a country with very complicaed systems. You should start by contacting national and local organisations that deal with your area of work, the French education authorites etc etc. Surely, that’s where any intelligent research should start and for it to be complemented by people’s experiences on forums or elsewhere.  What is the name of the organisation in France governing your sector? This is France so there are bound to be at least ten for starters[:)]

How many official French organisations have you been in touch with since you decided to move here?  This question goes to you and anyone else planning to move to another country. If I decided to move to Sweden (it will never happen as too cold), my first point of contact would be the Swedish national and local (to my chosen area) authorities to advise me on taxation, schooling, health contributions etc etc. Surely, that’s only sensible?

I simply wish that some of the thousands of people who return to the UK every year after their search for ‘better life’ abroad (not just France) would contribute to forums as they could offer invaluable advice. I personally know a few but sadly, none of them are interested in dwelling on ‘issues’ that made them return to the UK.

I sincerely wish you lots of luck Riff-Raff and like others have done, I'd stress that you should have a very healthy bank balance after you have bought your home because even if you do not need to spend a fortune on renovations, you will need it to live on before your business starts making a profit.

On a personal level, I enjoy myself here but I spent years researching everything and I am also fluent but none of these have prevented all pitfalls.  I chose to live in France of the 21^st century and not the one that resembles the UK of the 1950s (whatever that was) as so many people seem to crave when they move to rural France. Whether you choose to live in time-warp or modern France, you will need to know all about the modern systems if you are to run any business. Otherwise, wait until you retire as the retired ‘’appear’’ to be the most successful UK immigrants here.

 

[Russethouse]

One lady forum member was going to run a carp lake so you may find some relevant posts.

[Russethouse]

One lady forum member was going to by a carp lake so you may find some relevant posts.

Here is one : http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/711954/ShowPost.aspx

[Coco]

[quote user="KathyC"]

Hi

I often think that what many people are looking for is a move from the town/city to the country rather than from the UK to France . Personally, I feel  that it might be worthwhile asking yourselves the question "If we could buy the country property/lake/renovation project/guest house for the same price in the UK as we can in France, would we still want to move over?". If the answer is "no" then I would think very carefully about your plans. A move to the country is a difficult enough proposition without adding in the extra complications of a foreign country; unless you really love the idea of moving to France (and accept that your idea may well change with more knowledge) then I would think and think again.

[/quote]

I think this is one of the most sensible statements I've seen on this forum in a long, long time.  And I'm sure that probably more than 50% of the people who ask themselves this question would answer "no"; certainly 95% of the house-hunters we have had staying at our B&B.  Most ask us why we moved and before we even have a chance to draw breath they always answer for us:  "I know, Britain's gone to the dogs hasn't it, don't blame you."  BUT NO that isn't why we moved here.

We bought our house here in 1999, having had our first thoughts about moving to France back in 1983 and starting serious research in 1994 and serious house-hunting in 1997.  We moved here in 2003 and many friends suggested that if we really wanted to run a B&B why didn't we move to somewhere in the country in the UK instead.  But that wasn't the answer for us, but sooo many people say that they just couldn't afford the sort of property they wanted in the UK and that's why they've moved to France.  It's hard enough to adapt to life in a foreign country and that is not really an important enough reason for choosing to do so.  Life is hard here and there are things we miss about the UK, there are things that are done differently here and not always as well as in the UK but overall it still suits us better than our previous life in the UK.

One thing I would say Mr Riff is that you need to do careful research on your potential carp business because you're going to have to earn a lot of money to support two families and you've got at least another 10-15 years of full-time education for those kids to think about.

[pagnol]

Sometime ago there was a programme on Channel 4 about a young British family who moved to Brittany to start a carp fishing business. The chap (Kevin) was a builder and licked the house they bought into shape in no time at all!

The children settled well and I believe the lady concerned had another child in France.

The business is still going so they must be doing something right and coping with the French red tape.

The site is www.clearwaterlakes.com

They may be able to give you first hand advice.

Bst wishes

Vanessa

 

[Will]

Yes, it proves that those who come to France can do well with the right approach.

The initial problem is the two family thing which, though far from impossible, does not fit into the French ways and is likely to put obstacles in the way before the project can even start to be implemented. Once it has been solved though, anything else will probably look simple given the positive attitude that the original poster has. It's only right that the difficulties should be identified and sorted out in the beginning.

[riff_raff]

Hi everyone, thank you for all your replies...this is Mrs Riff here now As my husband doesn't explain himself very well I thought I would write a few lines  With regards to 'A better life'....what we mean by that is away from the built up towns, which is where we live now, more than 10 minute walk away from the airport!! Which is where we live now, more fresh air, with less cars as it will be a rural area we plan to move to. We all intend to learn the language and my 11year old son is prepared to redo year 7 when we move so he can concerntrate on learning the French language.  We will be without a doubt hiring a tutor or two to teach us all. We all love France and the French people, hopefully they will like us too!!  (we are not really riff raff) A fishing lake has always been our dream, we are not expecting to end up mega rich or anything and will be happy with enough business to feed and cloth ourselves.  Basically 'A better life' to us means, peace and quiet, countryside, nature, being happy and enjoying our lives.  The children are all very excited about moving and talk about it non stop.  Both our properties are now on the market and we are currently seeking advice on the whole moving process with a legal expert that specialises in french law.  We have to do this exactly right and strictly by the book as we want no unexpected nasty surprises that could have been avoided.  We do intend to make this our permanent home and do not intend to move back to the UK.  We will also be seeking legal advice on the subject already mentioned on the board of what is one of us dies or wants to move back or whatever.  Also the inheritance issue will have to be sorted out properly too, we are also currently seeking advice on these issues too.  Thank you all so much for raising points for us to discuss and get rectified before any problems begin.

[LanguedocGal2]

Hello Mrs Riff Raff

Disappointed you are not really riff-raffs, thought I had found some kindred spirits.[:D]

Good luck to you all in your venture. Reassured that you are getting proper professional advice. Once you get here, do not hesitate to let off steam on the forum - shows you're human in my books.

Bonne chance.

[Tresco]

It's nice to see someone respond to the advice given by forum members so positively.[:)]

I'm just a bit concerned about this though;

[quote user="riff_raff"]We will have no mortgage to worry about paying and a little bit left over to tide us over so to speak.[/quote]

For up to ten people, you are going to need more than a little bit, so I hope that was a euphamism for, errm, a lot'll bit.[:)]

[riff_raff]

[:D]Mr Riff's wording does leave alot to be desired doesn't it lol.  We will in fact have quite a large sum left over.  Their house is worth £20K more than they thought and ours is worth £10K more than we estimated[:D] That was a nice surprise I can tell you. Just in case anyone is thinking this is a bit of a weird set up....we do not intend to live in the same house for the rest of our lives!!! This will be a temporary set up while we concentrate on the business.  We are taking our four berth caravan with us too  I have a feeling this is going to be a valuable piece of equipment to get some peace and quiet!!  Luckily Mr Raff is a builder and we hope to build houses in the future, which is why we have to be sure we won't be buying a red herring that you can never build on or whatsnot!! The advice given so far has been amazing and has certainly put us on the right track alot sooner than we might have found it had we not stumbled on this forum. thanks everyone.

[Tresco]

[quote user="riff_raff"]We will in fact have quite a large sum left over... Just in case anyone is thinking this is a bit of a weird set up....we do not intend to live in the same house for the rest of our lives.  [/quote]

It gets better and better.[:)][;-)]

[riff_raff]

Oh god I will have to give Mr Riff a kick when he gets in from work for the way he has worded his posts and given everybody the wrong idea about sharing a house!! [:$]