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Tiling on green plasterboard


Mutiara
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Hi, I would think the "green" plasterboard would be hydrofuge, we used this in our showers and tiled directly on to it, with as yet no problems, so far !!, providing all the grouting you do is very sound. We are only amatuers at this so someone else may be able to offer other information. Mel.
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This should ensure a perfect seal and you should have no problem with water infiltration:

  • a primer first

  • waterproof sealing tape on all panel-to-panel, panel-to-floor joints and pipe openings

  • two layers of waterproof coating (a vertical coat; dry for 2 to 4 hours; a horizontal coat; dry for minimum 12 hours; then tile)
For example, an all-in-one kit like this one contains enough primer, strips and waterproofing for 5m².

Edit: see this page

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Hi Clair, very interesting. I am here in the UK and the nearest place that sells Weber is a long way. Do you think the Dunlop product below would be just as good?  I assume that when one of these products are used it isn't necessary to use the same brand of glue to fix the tiles.

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/79333/Sealants-Adhesives/Building-Maintenance/Kitchen-Bathroom/Dunlop-Shower-Waterproofing-Kit

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Green boards should be fine as should most  other boards.

Ceramic tiles are pretty much impervious as is good quality grout and sealant. What generally lets shower installations down is inadequate installation.

Attention to detail in the planning and installation should all but eliminate water penetration. If you are reliant upon the water resistance of the plasterboard from the outset I am afraid you have failed.

Top tips unless its a level access tray, strengthen the floor beneath the tray (I use 3/4ply) screwed through to joists (Don't screw into wires / pipes).

Wastes often fail as the tray becomes loaded due to their not having sufficient room to move (Please consider using top access wastes far easier to clear a blockage than ripping the shower apart)

I always make the waste up to the tray in advance using silicone sealant and wiping away all excess proprietary foam gaskets tend to be a bit rubbish rubber ones are better.

The tray needs to be as solidly affixed as poissible, the slightest movement will cause leaks and a 17 stone Big Mac leaping about in the cubicle will soon make a poorly fitted tray let go.

If using a plastic tray with screw holes in the feet use them! thats what they are there for yes it's a pain but ultimately worth it.

Screw a batten to the walls below the lip of the tray (If not level access) in such a fashion that it touches all the way around.

Fit tray and tighten nuts or if a resin bonded tray bed down in lean mortar to either reinforced floor or elevated platform robustly constructed out of 4x2 and 3/4ply

Once set / clamped in position then gun the tray in using low modulus silicone sealant between the tray and the walls making sure the tray is tight up to the walls, allow to set

If walls are masonry then the plaster should be cut back to allow the tray to but up to the brick/block to take any out of square out then plastered back in ....do not overdo this otherwise the enclosure (If there is one may oversail the tray and look awful.

Place spare timber below the tray and grip it in position leaving just sufficent room for the installation of 'folding wedges' these are very tin wedges usually of hard wood which when faced to each oother and squeezed together in a gap will take up the space (I use a carpenters ratchet clamp to squeeze them into position) once taking up the slack...don't overdo it place a blob of gripfill (If working to a chipboard based tray) at the ends to stop them moving in the future let every thing set up for a day (All the operations outlines thus far will take about a mornings work so get on with fitting the rest of the suite).

Tile as per usual (Making sure tiles are vertical in relation to tray otherwise enclosure will not fit, leaning walls need to be straightened before tiling, only small tolerances can be taken up by the cabinet  using good quality adhesive and grout (Water resistant both) allow adhesive  to set up then grout using a grouting float and slightly thinner grout mix than you may think this allows for good penetration and bond, don't get too much grout into the bottom horizontal edge (Rake out using a folded bit of card)

Once tiles have been dusted (Do this three of four times in a well ventilated room) and the room cleaned then the enclosure can be installed. 'Dry' fix it first and ensure starter profiles are correctly located and within tolerance before removing and reinstalling incorporating a generous bead of silicone sealant behind, tighten up then clean away all excess sealant squeezed out.

Install and seal cabinet in accordance with instructions, generaly the cabinets should be sealed internally using silicone sealant only on the vertical joints not the horizontal. At the same time gun in the tray edge to the tiling and any internal vertical corners.

Externally seal the cabinet to tray using a neat bead of silicone sealant to horizontal and vertical joints.

I haven't bothered with the fitting of the shower or shower valve as that should be adequately covered in their own instructions.

Fit any external trims and do not use for 48 hours.

Enjoy your leak free for many years shower.

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Thank for all replies and especially to Clair - that is just the type of product I am looking for.

I have a very good installation of shower tray and placo walls already but was unsure about tiling directly onto placo. I would rather use a Weber kit for belt and braces .

 

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I guess you must be expecting water coming through the wall then because that's the only other way for it to get wet. It's a bit like keeping a torch in the fridge in case the light doesn't work.... but it's your money. Good luck etc.

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 The type of kits that Clair has recommended really are belt and braces and really do give a better finished product than tiling directly onto the placo.

Although the hydrofuge placo is moisture resistant, it is not waterproof, and I am not aware of placo joint filler that is water resistant either. In fact most "plaquistes" in France use standard placo filler for green placo joints, therefore making corners and joints susceptible. Therefore the weber and broutin kits really do give a belt and braces job. However I do base my observations on French methods and practices, on what is locally available.

I am sure there is a DTU norme on this that would give a definitive answer on what is the recommended practice.

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The point I am making is that the plasterboard in a good installation doesn't need to be waterproof. therefore money spent on something to waterproof the already moisture resistant board seems superfluous.

If water is going to get past your tiling and sealing you could still ultimately end up with a shower tray full of tiles.

 

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[quote user="BIG MAC"]

The point I am making is that the plasterboard in a good installation doesn't need to be waterproof. therefore money spent on something to waterproof the already moisture resistant board seems superfluous.

If water is going to get past your tiling and sealing you could still ultimately end up with a shower tray full of tiles.

 

[/quote]

I see where you are coming from but I disagree, 

The point I am trying to make is that if you have used a recommended undersealant kit then at least the water will not penetrate past the placo and ruin it.

Many leaks occur over a long period of time doing unseen damage, which is exactly what would happen if you tiled directly onto plasterboard and had a hairline crack in the grouting, with water seeping through over a period of time. 

This would not be a problem with a sealant:mesh  kit which would repel any water. I have seen some terrible shower tiling which is why I asked the question. Personally, I would rather spend my extra few euros on this to be safe.

I googled some terms on carrelage douche and the general consensus seems to agree; with me.

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I asked the question because I need to consider the worst case scenario and use a product because I will not be doing the tiling myself. The original tiler we had was meant to do two bathrooms and did a complete bodge job with the first ([:(]) so will not be doing the second. The next bathroom that the new tiler will be tiling does not have green placo so for me I would like to put a product on myself before he does the tiling.

Just wish Big Mac was near our place in France and looking for work of course.[:)]

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i tend to agree with clair the weber seaaling kits are indispensible and would be what a professional would seal the plasterboard with before tiling if they knew what they were doing. personally i would spend the extra money and use wedi boards instead of placo and a wedi shower base before sealing and tiling chacun son facon a travail and quality costs
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"I tend to agree with clair the weber seaaling kits are indispensible and would be what a professional would seal the plasterboard with before tiling if they knew what they were doing. personally i would spend the extra money and use wedi boards instead of placo and a wedi shower base before sealing and tiling chacun son facon a travail and quality costs"

Laughing here as I have professionally installed literally hundreds of luxury bathroom suites in my working life along with many others. Of course we didn't know what we were doing or we would have used Mssrs Weber's wall waterproofing jollup. Perhaps the question should have been put along the lines "I fully expect my bathroom suite will move thereby allowing water through to the moisture resistant boards below, whatever shall I do"?

While you are at it best waterproof the floor adjacent to the loo I mean you often see puddles in front of a loo. And the ceiling best encapsulate it because it gets steamy in there.

I obviously am not being much help here because I suspect it's not the waterproofing that you want it's the theoretical peace of mind.

Incidentally the vast majority of shower leaks into the room below come from failed wastes you can waterproof the bejasus out of the walls and still have a ceiling full of water.

The No 1 waterproofing medium is having someone competent doing the work.

I shan't coment further there's little point. Good luck.
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I think I understand where Big Mac is comming from.

The last of many bathroom/wet room tiling jobs we did for a large hotel in Brighton, we were just the tilers, not the architects and you do as you are instructed to do on site. There was no green plasterboard, just grey, no special coatings to be used first.  We laid the tiles on a solid bed of grooved adhesive to try and prevent any water getting into the boards later. It's all about money on sites, don't blame the builders, blame the penny pinchers (bean counters)

Does that make it right? No I don't think it does but with only an NHBC 2 year warantee to worry about you'll be off. In France any tradesman has this 10 year insurance so if you don't do it using the sealimg kits and compounds and something goes wrong 9 years and 10 months later you will be back there making it right so use the best you can. These additional waterproofing measures are not exclusive to Webber, any decent tiling shop features similar these days.

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I don't wish to enter a debate about who is right and who is wrong

As a professional I have installed and tiled countless showers in France

I have never had a tile fall off the wall or a problem with water seepage

This is what I do

Shower tray

Position the tray and mark the plasterboard along the top edge of the tray

Remove tray and apply silicone sealant to the plasterboard below the marked line, install tray

Apply silicone sealant to the joint between the top of the tray and the plasterboard

This is the water seal, not the silicone applied after tiling which I view a purely decorative

Use this method and water can never seep down the back edge of the tray

Tiling

I always use Weber Broutin, would not use anthing else

If you go to Point P or any reputable builders merchant you can pick up the Weber Broutin catalogue for free

It contains a wealth of information and will tell you the correct combination of primer, adhesive and grout to use for you particular application

With green plasterbord the surface should be sealed and the correct adhesive and grout used

If tiling with stone it is vital to also seal the stone twice, once after laying the tiles and again after grouting

Maybe this why you shudder and think you are being ripped off when you get a price from a professional

There are many cheap solutions but the proper one is normally the best investment in the long run

Le Plombier

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