Espresso

Does anyone have any more information about this please? The link seems to have died.

At least these issues are being more commonly discussed. There are a lot of Brits in France who still don't have a clue that their British wills (and whatever they intended to do with their estate) are irrelevant in France. There are new buyers setting up complicated ways of buying to try to get round some of these problems. And there are those like myself, who are stuffed. France might be an option for me later in life, but maybe not full-time. I like my will just the way it is.

Unmarried couples face (worst case) 60 percent death duties, over (about) €75000. Entering into a PACS only lowers this to 40 percent and 50 percent (there's two tiers), over (about) €57000.

Hi Hagar Yes - a PACS would improve my situation marginally. I've read what Pomhorn has said and it sounds like succession could become easier (the idea of being able to 'give' the property to the surviving partner). I'll have to wait and see what they do about the tax - or, at least, the PACS partner's rights in inheritance. If they could close the gap between married and PACS-joined... things could become more interesting. I guess we wait and see. Best Espresso

Hagar: "I sometimes think that many people in the UK (as evidenced by the numerous articles in the Financial Press) have an unhealthy obsession with inheritance tax and avoidance thereof." In my case, it's because my (unmarried) partner would most likely suffer financial difficulties, alone in France, after my death (or vice versa). In the UK, the tax burden would be lower (depending on the rate and threshold when either of us pops our clogs), and we can engineer "spouse's rights" with a Civil Partnership. I wouldn't want anyone to think I was just squirming because I don't like parting with money. (Even though I don't! ;-) )

Fair points. But these issues rapidly get to the size where they won't fit in my brain anymore. Sorry - feeble I know. I'm a little worn out with French red-tape matters at the moment. :-(

It's difficult to know how closely one's assets - inherited from one's parents - might be scrutinized. A chunk of both our assets is (or will be) inherited money.

In my case, we're not married, so there are no spouse's rights. I had also read the stuff you've linked to, by the way. I didn't like this: "If the deceased has neither children nor grandchildren nor living parents, the surviving spouse inherits the entire estate, except for any assets that the deceased may have received as a gift or inheritance from his or her parents. Half of these assets will revert to the deceased spouse's brothers and sisters or their children or grandchildren. In this situation (i.e. when there are no living descendants or ascendants), the deceased does not have the option of eliminating the rights of the surviving spouse in their entirety, since French law reserves at least one quarter of the estate to the survivor. We should also note that, without exception, the surviving spouse is entitled to free use of the home that serves as his or her primary residence and the furniture it contains for a period of one year after the death of his or her spouse." This, and the hefty death duties are (for me) unworkable, compared to what I could put in place in the UK. I have since read something, and lost it, that implied that (in some cases) they stop looking down the family line after descendants and ascendants (ie, no siblings, their children, their children's children, and Uncle Tom Cobbley and anyone who happens to be passing by at the time!). ;-)

It's pretty damned depressing how law and order, and social standards, have sunk so far in the UK (etc etc, blah blah blah). Having read the above, it sounds like the police are too busy running their own rackets to be of any use protecting the public. Shame they weren't even clever enough to pull it off. I wish I hadn't read this thread now. It was compulsive reading, and I sympathize, but life is depressing enough without this. :(

That does make a lot more sense.

This is all pretty horrific stuff. I'm not sure I can read much more of it, but I'm sorry you've been subjected to all this. It does sound like some sort of personal vendetta. I come from Surrey, so I know the Surrey Police are referred to as the 'SP'. But that doesn't seem relevant here? "...you know what you have to do" sounds like something you'd expect from a thug in a protection racket. If I was watching this on TV, I'd expect the twist to be that they want you to pay them to get off your back. Sorry if that's way off the track.

Quote - Pads: I have tried emailing the mairie to introduce us to him, as we are currently buying a house, but we have had no reply ___________________ It's really common for emails to seemingly be ignored in France - as if they haven't really taken to email. Some people reply, some never reply, and some reply after about a month (or more, when you've forgotten the point of contacting them in the first place! ;-) ).

Those are new variations (to me) on buying as an unmarried couple. It sounds like you are getting the ownership sorted out to your satisfaction. Have you come up with a plan for the inheritance tax (estate tax / death duties)?

Although I feel a bit like I've been through a maze and every route I tried was blocked in some way, I did get one tidbit of advice that doesn't seem to have been discussed fully here. Some people consider life assurance is a good way to set aside money for the payment of IHT. I was told that, although you can do whatever you choose, this is a fairly extreme course of action, since the life assurance payout is tax free (if the surviving partner is the beneficiary) and you are using it to pay tax...

The quotes from the notaires' site bring me back to one of Phil's original points. He and his partner are not married. So there is no 'spouse'. This is the same in my situation, and - as far as I can ascertain - a PACS agreement does not give you "spouse's rights", such as they are (nor the same estate-tax rates).

Thanks very much for the replies. Ronan, no - you're not the only person to think PACS is a bit impersonal. It's quite widely seen as a bit begrudging. PACS deals are signed and sealed in little offices, with a clerk and that's all there is to it. A no-frills business deal. The French authorities also make it difficult for anyone (journalists have tried) to find out how many PACS agreements have been made. It's all a bit 'swept under the carpet'.

Phew! I sympathize, Phil - and I also totally empathize. My partner and I thought we were the only people who couldn't get the whole French equation to work, and (after months of dreams, visits to France, searching for houses online and for real, having houses surveyed... and generally falling in love with the whole idea of moving to France) we feel like it's just impossible for us. We feel pretty p'd off. We got legal advice. In our case, there are no kids, but a notaire assured us that where there are no kids and parents, the authorities will look for the nearest blood relative (in this case, a sister on one side and a brother on the other... followed by their kids etc), in order to force seccession. The bottom line looked like, whatever we did, we risked one partner being left with a nasty tax bill and the possible loss of the house - depending on what our finances were like at the time. We shouldn't forget, I suppose, that France is waking up to the joys and woes of property ownership, and laws are changing in the UK and France, especially relating to estate tax, capital gains tax, and more people will be pushing for better tax breaks. Maybe things will change.

I think I can probably guess the answer to this, but would a UK civil partnership be recognized in France? I've searched high and low - here and generally on the internet - but can't find anything. PACS unions can be entered into by non-French people. Am I right in assuming you need to be resident in France (ie, more-or-less French) when you want to set up a PACS?