Patmobile
-
Posts
537 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Never
Posts posted by Patmobile
-
-
REUTERS"Viviane Reding, the EU's fundamental rights commissioner, dropped her previous accusation that the “disgraceful” policy amounted to illegal discrimination against gipsies.
Instead, she warned France that it was in technical breach of EU law by failing to properly incorporate a 2004 free movement directive into national law, a substantial softening of her previous position.
“The Commission accepted France’s assurances that the measures taken have neither the aim nor the effect of targeting a specific 'minority’ and that French authorities apply EU law in a non-discriminatory fashion,” said a two-page statement.
The case has strained relations between Paris and Brussels after an angry confrontation between Nicolas Sarkozy, the French President, and senior Commission officials at an EU summit on Sep 16.
Mrs Reding was forced to withdraw her comparison of the Roma policy with Vichy France’s Second World War collaboration with Nazi round-ups of ethnic minorities after President Nicolas Sarkozy demanded an apology for a “disgusting and shameful attack on the honour of France”.
Eric Besson, the French immigration minister, proclaimed victory for France."
Brussels lawyers, at great expense, no doubt, have advised that though France is in technical breach of EU law, there is no Human Rights case to answer. I could have saved them the time and (most of) the expense
Patrick
PS: NormanH, I read, write and speak French, English and German and have at least "a modicum" of legal training, but it wouldn't take a multilingual international lawyer to find the flaws in the EU's "case". I never said what Sarkozy did was nice, just that he, and France, broke no laws and infringed no-one's human rights. Their human dignity, maybe...
-
Brussels has withdrawn the threat of legal action in the European Court. It's clear they have realised they have no winnable case. As predicted by....Patrick
-
I'll believe he wants to distance himself from his predecessors when he denounces the "dodgy dossier" cooked up by Blair and his cronies and calls for a proper judicial enquiry.What's the betting all the paperwork has been "mislaid" just like Blair's expenses records.Patrick
-
[quote user="Quillan"]
I don't think its right to target a specific group like this. I agree with what the EU has said and to which Ade100 refers in that as a citizen/passport holder of an EU member state you can freely move around the European Union but you can't be a drain on the resources of the country in which you have chosen to reside. The only problem of throwing out all those that are a drain is that it would undoubtedly upset many other EU states when their citizens are returned. I mean, if you implement a law based on this EU directive then it has to be applied equally and fairly to all. I also don't understand why, like many Brits who paid very little in to the French State system, they can't be given some form of grace in the same way like if you have filled in a tax return for the last 5 years but the amount is zero or whatever you can stay.
[/quote]If this ever went to court, which it won't, because of the acute flimsiness of the Brussels case, the French government would say, quite justifiably, they are not "targetting" Roma but "prioritising" their removal from shanty encampments. If multiple large gangs of illegal Brits were setting up unsightly,illegal, unlicensed, unhealthy camps on both public and private property and using them as bases for various unwelcome forms of illegal activity, they could expect to be "targetted" in the same way. -
I knew an old bike from Bagnoles, once long ago.Patrick
-
I'm not arguing any moral point here. I'm simply suggesting Brussels should butt out and shut up. There is no point them wasting European taxpayers' money trying to take such a weak case to court.The Brussels bureaucrats simply can't say that other EU citizens wouldn't be treated in the same way - no other vagrant ethnic group from another EU country has taken advantage of EU rules to come to France and set up shanty encampments. But, if large parties of Celts, say from Cornwall and Wales, or Gaels from Ireland and Scotland came into France and squatted illegally on public and private land, are they saying they would not be seen as lawbreakers by the French government, and be treated in some other more favourable way? Are they suggesting the French government would not make it a priority to clean up the camp sites and send the vagrants back? Are they suggesting the name of the ethnic group the squatters, themselves, proudly claim should not be used when discussing them?If Brussels could give examples of different official French treatment for different races in the same circumstances they might stand a chance of winning a court case, otherwise they should stop wasting everyone's money and time by threatening pointless legal action. Patrick
-
[quote user="Albert the InfoGipsy"]
[quote user="Patmobile"]There might also be an argument as to whether "Roma" is in fact a distinct race or just a name for people of no particular race or nationality who live a nomadic way of life.
[/quote]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people
Particularly have a look at 'Origins'.
As you suggested, I'm considering changing my forum name.
[/quote]
Hi Albert,
I'm not saying there is no Roma, Romany, Rom, or whatever race, just that even to start to prove an act of racism you would potentially have to overcome first any defence argument that various groups of Romanian and Bulgarian travellers camping illegally could not be considered to be of one identifiable racial type.
Patrick
-
[quote user="pachapapa"]
But following your line of thought that, a priori, gets SNCF off the hook during the Vichy France Era; they were just transporting a mixed group of undesirables of multiple creeds and ethnicities.
But I fancy with a proper court and VERY competent lawyers in california it wont be a done deal; interesting to see how it turns out though as there are similar TGV projects for Texas,the Chicago area, Florida, NewYork, etc.
[/quote]The crux of this very different case is that these people, Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals etc., mostly of French nationality, were being rounded up in their own country, having committed no crime other than belonging to a particular racial, religious or genetic group, and knowingly transported by SNCF to slavery or death camps.It's a completely different case in almost every way.Sarkozy's government has not infringed the Human Rights of the Roma shanty dwellers. They have not complied with the law and are expelled (though with financial comfort) to their country of origin where they are not enslaved, tortured or shot, and they are not prevented from returning whenever they like. Moreover, they will be permitted to stay, the next time, provided they are in full compliance with France's legitimate requirement that they have jobs or are capable of supporting themselves, and are not breaking the law by creating unlicensed encampments.Patrick -
It might be considered a racist policy if there were no other criteria for action other than being "Roma". However, as I read it the government called for action to clear illegal encampments of all types - adding, perhaps unwisely, Roma encampments as a priority. I reckon in a proper court any reasonably competent lawyer could argue sucessfully that the government meant no racial bias, merely setting an order in which action was to be taken against any and all offenders, excepting none.There might also be an argument as to whether "Roma" is in fact a distinct race or just a name for people of no particular race or nationality who live a nomadic way of life. If it goes to court France should win this case.Patrick
-
I'm following the posts on the Loire forum but can't be sure I can get involved with the building - or even the trip, as September tends to be a busy time for me.I'm looking for a suitable lightweight designBy the way, to keep up with the latest terminology, shouldn't you be known as Albert the InfoRoma or even InfoRom? Look out or they'll expel you!Patrick
-
Viking funeral please - in the old boat leaning up against the stable wall, that I will never get round to restoring.That should break every French law in the bookPatrick
-
Hi AlbertI could be interested so I've joined the group and looked in on the forum, but canoes aren't really my thing. I'm thinking about building a lightweight rowing boat for it.Patrick
-
I don't know what is required for power driven craft, but if your boat is less than 5 metres long, moves exclusively under human power (i.e. oars, paddles, punt pole, etc) and you only want to use it on lakes, canals and rivers, it does not have to be registered. Same applies if you want to use it in the sea not more than 300 metres from shore.Also boats less than 2.5 metres in length with motor propulsion of less than 3kw (4cv) are exempt from registration for use on the waters defined above. Every other craft outside of these exclusions has to be registered and a "Carte de Circulation" obtained (to be carried on board at all times). I presume this applies to any power boat of over 2.5m, since obviously it would not be exempted under the above rules.I believe there is a horsepower limit, above which the owner/driver needs to have a personal certificate of competence, too.As Albert points out, not all rivers and lakes allow powered craft at all, and limits apply on some other stretches of water.Patrick
-
[quote user="Mattyj198"]
So next year I plan to spend the summer
doing renovations on our new house in France. It has 2 houses, onewill be the main house accessible by gates from the street and theother the guest house where we will rent out rooms. That house has adoor right out on to the street.[/quote]Call me cynical but it sounds perfect for guests who want to run off without paying. I would block up the door to the street and if necessary put in another door somewhere to make them enter and exit through the gates. That, or make them pay in advance.Patrick -
[quote user="bubbles"]Well, there's a new French word I've come across!Apparently, in our region the restrictions have been "picnifiees".I love it.[/quote]I read that as "planifiees", but I do agree "picnifiees" is a great word which should be used as often as possiblePatrick
-
That sounds like a really useful treasure trove of bits.I'm researching designs for next year's boat, one that would be suitable for the Morbihan Week events, and I'm getting seriously drawn to a 17ft American design which has won a few tough endurance events. As it uses unstayed masts I'm hoping to be able to use two of my windsurf masts that are still lying about in the outbuildings. The last and most boring bit about building boats is making the centreboard and rudder foils. Some people actually do them first so that it gets the boring stuff out of the way. If it turns out, once I've decided what I'm going to build, that you have a rudder or centreboard that could fit or be adapted, I would be really grateful.Patrick
-
The boat eventually went in the water on Sunday June 27. She floats, rows and sails. No leaks! Here are a couple of pictures taken during and after the maiden voyage[IMG]http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af173/patmobile/sailing1.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af173/patmobile/apressailing.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af173/patmobile/apressailing2.jpg[/IMG]I'm now planning next year's bigger boatPatrick
-
Hope you have a nice time in the mountains. I'm having a bit of trouble with French varnish! Sanding like a madman now to make the rudder blade fit between the cheeks of the stock. It'll all be done by tomorrow - or Friday, maybe Saturday!Patrick
-
Yes, your boat is a close cousin to the local type by the look of it.I cut out and shaped up all the bits for the rudder today and glued up the rudder stock parts. I was going to make a straight rectangular blade but then I figured I had messed about with the design enough already so I made it the curvy shape on the drawings. Very pretty, but probably no more effective as a rudder.Painted the oar blades the same colour as the hull, too, just to have something to do while resin takes all day to go off.The design calls for a massive tiller carved from solid oak but I'm going to lash something up out of bits of plain old pine. At this rate I'll be in the water by the end of the week - touch wood.Patrick
-
Thanks for the pics. I'll think about knocking up something like that for mine.Is that a slot for a leeboard on the side of the boat? It wasn't there in the earlier pics.Patrick
-
I love the wheels. I may copy that idea. Are they held in place by a strap? Or is it a proper trolley rather than just a set of strap-on wheels?I've just put a 2nd coat of varnish on the deck and daggerboard. Silly, because now I daren't cut any ply for the rudder for fear of making a lot of dust that will ruin the gloss finishOn top of that the sun's gone, it's turned cool, and the varnish probably won't dry for 24 hours!Patrick
-
What is AE registration? Does it mean you're a real craftsman - not an amateur like me?I refer to my Gougeon Brothers book frequently when working with Epoxy. I hadn't used it before - I used traditional marine glue, screws, nails, and polyester resin last time, 30 years ago. This time everything was joined by epoxy resin and there are only about 4 screws in the whole boat.I may switch to ply clinker construction next time because it gives you a clean interior finish without lots of glass tape and resin to hide.Just had another look at Francois Vivier's site, and see that he supplies full size mylar film patterns for some designs. That would certainly save a lot of time and effort. Patrick
-
Although I am normally a fan of Jack Holt designs, I never liked the Mirror. It's always looked awfully clumsy to me.I really like the Francois Vivier designs, but most of them look complicated to build. And there's always the problem of the instructions being either in French or a bad translation from French so that some crucial bits might not be clear.Ian Oughtred designs beautiful boats and the plans are works of art - they should be framed when you finish building. But the boat I fancy building next is Paul Fisher's 15ft Medway Doble. Construction is actually easier than the dinghy I've just built, it's lightweight for its volume, it rows well and it carries a decent amount of sail for its size. Just right for Morbihan Week I reckon.Patrick
-
[quote user="La Guerriere"]That's a very dinky dinghy (or should that be a dinghy dinky?). Can you put up a link for where you got the plans ?[/quote]Greenshank dinghy plans from Selway Fisher Design - I made some modifications because the very nice slender Needlespar mast, that I saved from another dinghy I built years ago, needs support at deck level. Also it's OK for kids to sail these little boats sitting or kneeling on the floor, but I'm too old for that so I put in side benches. [quote user="Albert the InfoGypsy"]I've got the same intention. The boss is sympathetic, but I may have too many other commitments. How about you build the back, I build the front and we stick them together when you get here?[/quote]Good idea! My end will be built in metric units. I'm only saying that because sometimes plans are drawn in Imperial and I haven't got any rules or measuring tapes with feet and inches on. I believe they had a problem with the Hubble telescope because some parts were built by people working in metric and the rest by people using Imperial measurements. We wouldn't look too good with two halves of a boat that wouldn't fit together!Patrick
Postal voting gripes!
in The Complete France Post Bag
Posted