idun

I can see that Betty. Over 20 years in a village and over 30 in France and to not be invited, triste innit. Was it good fortune that we were 'invited'? Did the effort we made to meet new people and make new friends make the difference? For we still have very good friends in France.

Which web site is that then? I am from well north of the Watford Gap.

chancer now I think about it we have had huge runs out to get stuff, we just sort of did it, In fact we just used to get out and go. I used to go and see a friend who lived 80kms away for a couple of hours on an afternoon, or go to Lyon or Geneva. There again, that may have been in the heady days when I was paying 2Francs90 for a litre of gasoil but it did creep up eventually. The biggest run out we ever had was that husband said he would like me to go with him when he had to pick something up one day. And the place was about 20kms north of Chartres, so 650kms there and 650 back. And this thing he picked up he never used, then left in France giving it to a friend, so it wasn't something that we ever really needed anyway.

Ah now I understood early on what preservati(f)(ves) were and with my accent sounds the same anyway. I used to find it reassuring when I was back in the UK that there were none in many products and slightly revolted that I had even considered the possibility that there could have been. Can't do smileys.

Now that just reminded me. Moi getting to grips with french - amused my friends and neighbours and most people at the school no end when we got our femail puppy. I being dumb thought that if a boy pup was a chiot, then a girl one was a chiotte.

Sorry Chancer, I should have looked up 'scierie' for you. It was only 'addressed' to you, in so far as your points seem to me, at least, to echo what so many others have said and done. My point naturally being that these days, it isn't that hard to get to grips with things.

I know some of the earlier posters who were banned. Others left France or just stopped posting. Maybe Chancer sort of hit the nail on the head a bit: ' Up untill about 2 or so years ago I would say that 100% of the knowledge that I had of France and living in France had come from this forum'. Maybe some people got sick of answering the same old questions, it is a possiblity. In fact there you go Chancer, Long link removed as per suggestion http://www.pagesjaunes.fr/trouverlesprofessionnels/rechercheClassique.do?idContext=165758109&portail=PJ the builders yards in Arras and Amiens. Lots of Scierie in the www.pagesjaunes.fr too, if you haven't found any yet. Yes, it was a hard learning curve when we got there. We went for an adventure and nothing more. No french, no knowledge of France or the french and no internet, not even a phone for 2 years. And it was expensive. House deals, not on your life in our bit of the Rhone Alpes, or at least where we wanted to live, which was not a glamorous choice by any means, instinct kept me away from petit bled and nulle part, yet our village still ended up being a claustrophobic, although for many years, probably 20, I had been fine there. In comparison So Chancer, during the last few years, getting to grips with french stuff, in comparison to our journey really has been rather ‘easy’ apart from perhaps the language. Is it a wonder that I found this board very strange when I first found it. PS also during those first two years, we had a child and had a house built, and we didn't beak any local arrete by living in a caravan, we rented a total of two different apparts. I have no talent or ear for language it was a lutte to get what I wanted. Still speak french like a vache espagnol, and will never do any better even though, I still repeat phrases and words back to TV5 most days. Moving to France and not learning to communicate, or only enough to get by with the shopping is almost a crime in my eyes. Yes the forum has changed. Some of the people who thought I was negative at best, or even a troll seem to have mellowed as time has gone by. The great and biggest divide is ofcourse where one lives in France and what one does with ones time. There will be few posters, like for example Pucette, who became a peasant farmer and saw how things were in rural western France. Sadly I think that that ended in disaster, and would love to know if she is OK. Look at Norman, he lived in a town French and british towns are a bit different, but IMO the biggest difference you will find if comparing is between town and country living in France as opposed to comparing towns in France or anywhere else in europe. cooerlola summed up some of the people she had met and they sound like so many who used to post on here, insulated people IMO acting like colonialists. They miss so much, they don't even 'get' the good either in France when they live like that. I do have a subheading for those that speak fluent french ofcourse who are in a league of their own, no matter where they live and it will be down to their 'interest' in where ever they live, as to how they live their lives in their chosen communities. My life, well it is OK. My kids have not got over french education and I still encourage them to get more education and yet they were so damaged by it that they struggle to make that choice. I may say on here that I will regret to end of my days leaving them in that system, and it is as true now as it was then years ago, but I have never said it to them. I am a priveledged person. I have a life in the UK and I know that if tomorrow I just turned up in my old village in France that I will have a wonderful reception and be fussed over and looked after. I do get the 'good' in France, but am aware of the bad and ugly and always will be. And that perhaps is really enough.

"Well, I have just been wondering whether the crise and the fact that loadsa Brits have been going back means that the nature of discussion on the forum is changing. There seem to be many fewer setting-up type questions and more discussions involving people who have left France but who are now looking back, eg idun and Pranda, and who therefore have a different perspective. And it seems that the France good, UK bad postings have gone too. The breathless, naive worshipping of the country has eased, it seems, with much more hardnosed input - that is no bad thing. I reckon we need a lot more in depth stuff like this. It is a pity that Normie is not as active as he was for his little road side posts didn't half detonate well sometimes. But I guess he has other dusky fish to fry! Personally, I have reached the point where I find visitors from across the water rather odd creatures as their perspectives seem so distant and unrelated to my reality here. Just a thought!" I don’t think that I have a different perspective about France since I left. We had always planned on returning to the UK for our retirement, and that is what we did, nothing to do with the crise. Anyway my perspective about France was quite different to that of most of the other posters when I lived there. Rosy France was not where I lived. So how do I not relate to you now Wooly, but more importantly how did I then, when I lived in France. That I am an ‘odd creature’ is a fait accompli really. I am ‘odd’ in both countries! I still call friends in France regularly, and would love to pop across and see them, but ‘life’ has got in the way this year, but I will make time in the future. I also have my son in France, so hear it all, ie him not being able to do things yesterday coz of the greve and I watch TV5 most days. And we will always be ‘linked’ to France financially. In fact we will be tied to France for the rest of our days, which could and I think does make us different from those who leave and have nothing more in France. To post or not to post? Yes, now there is a thought!

No it is not anything other than is paid by the patient to the GP's in France. Same with most of the district nurses, that one encounters in the villages. Self employed, is that the right term for them? Just noticed that link, which looks about right. When I still lived there my french GP had been to England on holiday and had been staggered by the amount GP's got paid. And I have to say at my current surgery in the UK, I have a lovely spannish doctor and now a german doctor has joined the practice. At £120K a throw for a GP's pay, it would seem that it is worth the move to the UK. At one time in Paris some GP's earned less than the SMIC by the time they had paid for their cabinet and car to go and see patients.

We pay £87 a month for a 40' container. It was clean when we got it and in a secured container park. Just call several companies, that is what I did. None hassled me.

Fi, even if those first taxe d'hab/fonc bills had arrived when they should have done, they would have required pretty prompt payment. IF you didn't get a prelevement sorted out at the beginning of this year for these bills, then when these bills come in, once again they will require pretty prompt payment.

If you work in France, just call the people who deal with your health care and ask them. We are UK residents, french income, CEAM now from France, inconvenient as it only lasts a year. What did we all do pre computers eh?

Well with a fine pair of legs you should show 'em off and not distract from them by wearing socks with sandals! I remember going to Val d'Isere one winter and the most horrible, vile and dangerous man, sadly who was in the same group as us had sandals and socks on, and we had had 2 metres of snow. I have despised sandals and socks since. However, I do understand the romans wearing them. Hadrian's Wall is a strange bit of England, the weather tends to be 'worse' there than in the surrounding areas somehow , and I'm sure that the french would call it something like 'terre froide' or 'terre sauvage'. When we have visited the rain has usually been hard and almost horizontal and we reckoned that those dinky little leather skirts the romans were so fond of would have had woolen leggings and socks beneath otherwise they would have had chill blains on all extremities!!

Just call them and they will send one out. That is all I do and it always works.

I was en plein campagne for 25 years and was fine until those last few years when I really had had enough of it. We live in town nown not on an estate, didn't even want that, and go out into the countryside regularly and love it when we do, in fact, have become very appreciative countryside vistors these days! But it is nice to get home. This inspired me to call a good friend in France, who I haven't spoken to for a few weeks and I'll probably call a couple of others later today.

We fitted in well, very well in fact and still have lots of french friends but we never intended to stay in France and haven't. Retrograde moving back, non, the idea of living where we lived in France again, which was a nice house, with land in an absolutely gorgeous location, leaves me somewhat revolted for other than a nice holiday. Can't do rural anymore, can't do petit bled, nulle part. Gimme a town and buses and cinema and those most exquisite of things, a library and night school or day school in proper courses that I can afford AND the bonus of pubs and cheap artisans. In fact there has been absolutely nothing retrograde about our move, our quality of life has actually improved on what is was those last two or three years in France, when in spite being busy tarting the house up to sell, I was bored. And the good thing for these people is that they will be getting their kids out of french education and that seems a very good idea to me. (yes I know that some do well in it)

I know little of british pensions. We were in our twenties when we left. So do not know how french pensions compare to occupational pensions in the UK.

We sold our house during the summer of 2009 and the taxe d'hab payments for that year were done by prelevement, we paid in full. We had left France in 2008 and in 2009 did two declarations d'impots, one to our local tax office for earnings whilst living in France and a further one to Noisy CINR. When the avis d'impots arrived from the CINR, it said that we had paid 'O' impots, in spite of having paid up directly from salary every month after leaving France. And we had paid a lot more tax than when we lived in France as there are no allowances for couples etc. Next thing that happened was that the Taxe d'hab people got in touch and said that they were going to reimburse the full years payments and so they did. All of it. I have called and written and explained but they say that no, we didn't have to pay. And I have said, we owned a furnished house in France on the 1st of Jan 2009 and 'had' to pay taxe d'hab, but they still say no. Now, as I know of people who have ran into problems with the impots people raiding bank accounts, even reopening closed ones to put them in debit, with sometimes no reason or even justification, I feel that I cannot touch this money. And so it stands, like an elephant in the room. It is in the hundreds of euros too, so not a negligable amount either. How do I clear this up, is it a job for the mediator? could well be!

I suppose that that would be something else we could do and maybe I should be contacting them about, well my next post!

Sunday Driver and Will, I have looked at all these things on both sites. I called Noisy le Grand and they insist that we have to keep paying french tax, in spite of the link on their site saying that we don't. I have written and got no reply from them as yet, how long that wait will be, I have no idea. As HMRC seem more organised with the forms and Nottingham do quite happily issue them to uk pensionable french residents (non gov pensions bien sur), I have called them. I just thought I would check on here to see if this worked in the real world. Which it would appear to. As we still have french bank accounts I want all this in writing and sorting out before we have to do our next declaration. I do not want any disputes what so ever, so I do not want them emptying our french accounts or putting them in debit, which I know that they do when the mood takes them and leaving us with a Banque de France problem. We already have what I consider a grave problem which I will post about later today.

I don't think that your figures are other than for french residents. These are the current figures for non residents, there is an abattement of 10%, but no other allowances are made, ie for a couple or children and it is done via retenue a la source or as it would be called in the UK PAYE:- TAUX ET MONTANT DE LA RETENUE A LA SOURCE REVENUS DE L’ANNEE 2009 La retenue à la source applicable aux sommes perçues à compter du 1er janvier 2009 est calculée selon le tarif publié ci-après. 0 % moins de 13 977€ PA 12 % de 13 977 à 40 553 20 % au-delà de 40 553 We then do a UK tax return and deduct the tax we have already paid in France. What diference would it make to us if we had to pay it all in the UK and none in France, where we no longer live. Absolutely none. All I wanted to know is if this treaty works. As for all it looks like it should, and seems to from the UK end, so why can I not get someone in Noisy le Grand CINR to say it does and give me some documentation. Also they seem adverse to replying to my correspondence about this. PS If a treaty has been reached about double taxation allowing UK pensioners to opt out of paying UK tax on non gov pensions and only be liable to pay tax in France. Then why can't we? HMRC is being deprived of revenue if this is only a one way street and frankly I will kick up about this. As I say we will not be any worse off. Income tax in the UK is higher than in France and we pay no more than the higher amount, but UK pensioners who are french residents, would be worse off if this stopped.

LOL I know what I wrote, because if it were the other way round, then that is what we would do. And pay less tax ofcourse. I just wanted to see if it was working properly for those who have moved to France from the UK. And saying that we were in the reverse situation would have clouded the issue. I am not a drinker.

I am not confused. Our pensions are french and we are UK residents. Donc, if british pensioners (non gov pensions ofcourse) do not have to pay UK tax but can opt to pay french tax on their UK pensions, as there is a treaty that allows them to do so. Then why can we not do this the other way round, as there is a treaty. As far as how much we pay will not make one iota of difference to us. BUT it will mean that we give the money to the government of the country in which we live and frankly we want to do just that.

Yes, I do know how UK tax works and apparently they are very generous with people retiring to France who haven't got government pensions. Whereas les impots are not.

Now my problem is that I want to do this the other way round and the impots are not playing fair. HMRC say that there is a treaty, but it only seems to go one way. The impots insist that all french income has to have impots paid on it in France and that there is no way that they will allow it 'just to be taxed in the UK'. And yes, I had understood about the tax allowances in the UK on pensions. Thankyou for your reply, it looks like HMRC are honoring the treaty and les impots are not. Time to stir the hornets nest me thinks.